PvP is Toxic

Community General Discussion
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…and you will never convince me otherwise, at least in this game and the other MMOs.

I was going to go through and do a TON of quotes from all the toxics, but I figured I would wind up being reported and actioned for that, so I will just continue to state my opinions. I literally had 20 quotes lined up in this Create a New topic thing, but I went ahead and hit backspace on all of it.

I have seen everything from “git gud” to “skill issue” to outright trolling and lying about how the games systems work.

Me and friends joke about how Trials of Osiris is cancer…and it is. But I think MMO pvp is the worst of the cancers. And this is why:

MMO PvP can never be balanced. There are too many spells, damage resistances and other things that prevent balance. So, gear is almost always the deciding factor. At least in D2 your Gnawing Hunger is going to be the exact same damage output, disregarding things like Kill Clip which are easily farmable, as mine.

The PvPers will try to gaslight you into thinking its not hard to get geared for PvP, but that is only because they want you to join as an ungeared person. Its how the vast majority have fun. Look at the Q times for rated vs randoms for confirmation. You can spend 5 minutes for a RBG que, but 20 minutes for a Rated Arena que. (Compare the player size. Arenas should technically be faster).

Thing is, in order to start even getting that Conquest gear, you have to go through HOURS upon HOURS of getting your butt whooped, dealing with seeing “YOU SUCK” in chat because you cannot kill a single person, because your numbers are smaller than theirs, dealing with being a burden to your team, which usually means a loss.

Toxicity is why templates failed, its why SBMM is such a thorny issue in ANY PvP game: People who claim to be ‘the best’ 90% are always roflstomping newbies/lower geared.

If there were actual true PvP, where skill was the factor instead of numbers, you might see a lower playerbase, but the base would be happier. You wouldnt be seeing the so called ‘tear threads’, because the people in PvP would actually be having fun.

Look at the responses to Plunderstorm, if you will. The vast majority are saying it sucks, with a few people saying they are genuinely having fun, (Which is understandable, different boats different strokes and all) and the rest are just drinking the tears, mining the Salt, and generally being toxic somethingorothers.

This will be the last opining i have on the subject. I will not be finishing the Plunder, even though I want the sea horse and parrots, I will not do PvP in general…Unless its on my rogue, killing poor hapless alliance questers in that river area of Ohnharn Plains…(Which, according to Blizzard, is not toxic).

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Hell yea PvP is toxic.

That said, there’s very little toxicity in Plunderstorm. Arenas and casual BGs are where the toxicity is… and occasionally trade chat.

I HATE Plunderstorm, but there’s little to no toxicity in it. It’s usually complaining that Blizz put mog/mounts/pets/tendies behind a 40 renown garbo pile. If the tendies and mog weren’t there, people prolly wouldn’t play it.

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PVP does bring out the rage in some people.

I did it with duo’s to make it faster and easier.

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i don’t think its toxic. it is competitive.

you’ll find majoirty of pvp video games such as fps’s like cs,val and games like LoL and dota 2 are also “toxic” but its because people want to win. and alot of the time people don’t understand the difference between being toxic and being competitive. I also think gamers that don’t play sport don’t know how to work within a team environment and do not know sportsmanship so this leads to them coming off as toxic but in realiaty they are just competitive.

There should be a study done on it sports psychology wise. its pretty intersting stuff

does not mean people should say toxic things though like death threats ect ect

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Being competitive is fine. Telling someone to ‘git gud’ after asking a question is not, and if you look at the totally of replies, I would wager around 60% of all replies on this forum are some variation of an insult.

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What is competitive about being toxic towards others?

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Every competitive scene in the world is toxic af. Unfortunately, making fun of your opponent once you’ve beaten it has been normalized throughout the years; it’s despicable.

Absolutely not something only within this game; it’s the people that makes anything that involves person against person the worst experience.

Real sportsmanship is a value that slowly takes form in humanity.

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Have you seen: FF14 PvP? Where all numbers are flatly balanced along job balancing and gear has no part in it, with all the skills pruned down and made easier to use and everything is based around positioning and skill?

I don’t know if it would count as ‘better’ or non-toxic because there are still winners and losers, sore losers and ungracious winners. The whole concept of competition manages to bring out that simple issue with people regardless of how well balanced the game is, regardless if success is based upon RNG, skill, or lopsided odds.

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The Git-Gud mentality exists in PVE too, people spending 4 hours a day on the training dummies to increase their DPS by 1% telling you to do the same. Telling you to run 8 keys a week so at the end you get poop inside the dungeon and in the vault.

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Yes, there can be buttheads in PvE.

But compare the two. How many resources are there to help people gear, learn their class, get PvE old cosmetics, compared to the same of PvP.

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There are actually just as many guides for PvP as there are for PvE (Or more, even, given class-specific guides against different comps), and getting gear in PvP is vastly easier than it is in PvE. Old cosmetics? Well, aside from Elite sets which you can’t get past their season, you just get marks of honor by the boatload from PvP which can buy any of them.

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Oh for sure PVP is definitely more toxic than PVE will ever be, dont get me started on the parsers, but it’s WoW it exists everywhere.

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I would rather spend 10 hours trying to get a drop off an NPC I need than spend 3 hours dying over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again just for half of a dagger.

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That does have a tendency to bring out the worst in some people, but this is the wow forums, and having performance standards in content that has pass-fail throughput/mechanics checks is viewed as ‘toxic’ and ‘elitist’ here.

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Isn’t it nice now that people have no conceptualization of the difference that one can be silences as being toxic more easily now? I really wish people would realize the difference.

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You do realize there are weekly PvP quests where you don’t even need to win the BG, right? And Epic BGs which are mostly super-massive fights where you can make yourself less of a target or pure PvE like AV, and be fully honor geared in just a few hours? It is possible to be competitively geared in no time at all, and can even start getting conquest gear without stepping foot into the Arenas or RBGs once.

Most people who spend more than 10 hours on a single fight tend to give up, as you’d likely look to see any guild that takes more than that to progress on a non-mythic boss usually goes into hibernation from burnout and/or loss of morale. If you mean killing the same boss 200 times for a drop? Well, same applies, people usually give up beyond a certain threshold.

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Hi. Mailborn here. Go ahead and look at this toon. I did exactly what you just described with this toon, and I am still at a disadvantage.

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I’d say there’s more toxicity in M+ but I guess im differently biased.

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Wait, I can like my own post? That is sus af.

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Yes. Each character is treated as it’s own account by the forums, which opens the door to self liking, reporting the same post multiple times (although blizzard will give you a vacation if they find out you’re doing that), voting on polls multiple times (wonder when that will be relevant next), bypassing someone’s ignore to harass them, as well as more mundane problems like how trust level is per character (unless you have a current beta), and that a character re-name or server transfer resets your trust level, post history, and ignore list.

It’s a problem.

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