Quite wrong.
Forced PvP is the only difference between PvP and PvE servers. WPvP happens on PvE servers; “you can be ganked at any time in most of the world” is what does not.
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Oh geez, I’m so sorry. You have terrible friends! At least terrible “advice givers”.
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Blizzard took out pvp servers completely and try to sell us Warmode which is nothing more than PVE servers intermingling but it’s still PVE. So it’s natural for pvp servers to be more in demand for classic.
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There’s a ton of classic PvP servers this time around because there’s no retail PvP servers. Warmode is not the same.
Yep, PvP servers are for sociopaths. If you’re a good person and not a sociopath, don’t roll on one.
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First off, I agree that people complaining about open world pvp when they themselves picked a pvp server is kinda hilarious.
As for why there’s more PVP now than PVE … PVE tends to be friendlier for casual players who don’t wish to have the kind of social dependency needed for safe PVP server play. And when vanilla came out, half or more of the players were casuals. But casuals these days likely prefer retail over classic because retails is friendlier towards solo players. So in the end, there’s a higher demand for PVP servers that demand that close knit social dependency.
Personally, I like chatting and playing with guildies, but I don’t want to depend on their help. I also like playing solo sometimes. And that’s why I joined a PVE server. I don’t want to spend all my soloing time watching my back for a stealthed rogue or a massive enemy zerg that can massively overpower me. If I want to PVP, I have the ability to choose. On PVP servers, there is no choice. You learn to PVP and pick PVP talents … or you’ll just be food for those who do.
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Big PvP battles do happen on PvP servers, are memorable and fun, and make for great youtube videos. But big PvP battles are a tiny fraction of actual PvP, and for someone trying to rank, are largely a waste of time.
It sounds like 40 vs 40 would be a great way to farm honor, lots of people to kill. But honor is split. So 40 vs 40 is really just 1v1. But unlike 1v1’s, 40 vs 40’s are unsustainable. You have a big fight and that is it. Once you wipe a raid(especially if they lost badly) it usually disbands instantly.
If there is a large PvP battle, 95% of the time it is two raiding guilds from opposite factions who raid at the same time/day. Usually it is the byproduct of wanting to hold the MC portal for summons, or getting the UBRS fire buff.
But most raiding guilds don’t actually want to fight each other, because they normally come to raids with full world buffs, and even if they win a lot of people will die and lose their buffs(plus to largescale pvp effectively you have to use a lot of protection potions and sappers, which is expensive).
The only sustainable PvP model for phase 2 is ganking. Either as an individual or a small group roaming around high-level areas or at instance portals looking for easy kills. A level 50 in greens is worth as much or nearly as much as a level 60 in full epic gear.
And the vanilla honor system forces anyone trying to get rank 14, to do this at least 10 hours a day. On some servers it might even require 12-15 hours a day.
Yes, there will be at least a dozen people on every server playing 12 or more hours a day, doing nothing but ganking anyone worth honor. And hundreds more doing this 5-10 hours a day. And since the epic gear is so good, and the PvP brackets so narrow, they must be ruthless and uncaring.
I played a PvE server in old vanilla, and then I played on numerous private servers. PvE servers were better prior to battlegrounds, because rankers couldn’t just gank people. If they wanted to rank, they had to raid cities.
I can remember there constantly being raids formed for crossroads and Orgrimmar on my PvE server. Not just a bored guild either, but people recruiting for them. We even had a double raid once for Orgrimmar(two full raid groups).
I much prefer that model to the stupid gankfest that will be phase 2 on PvP servers.
I don’t think this constitutes “naming and shaming” tbh.
wait, isn’t this tos?
Hmm, this is sort of a tough one, I suppose. When I was a brand-new player, I initially rolled in Vanilla, on a PVE server, because friends were playing there. Once I got to max level, and realized what that meant (it’s not like I knew what PVE/PVP were or meant prior to ever playing an MMORPG, and WoW was my first then), I immediately rerolled onto a PVP server, and have never looked back.
For me, I despise PVE servers. That people would prefer or recommend them disgusts me, personally, but I understand that some people choose it for themselves.
My thoughts are that those who don’t like PVP in-game are doing their best to manipulate others, and destroy it for them. This is their version of PVP, and it is what has resulted in a complete removal of PVP servers from Retail. Now all servers are PVE, thanks to Warmode. It’s perhaps one of the worst changes to ever happen to WoW, imo.
That’s an interesting post, you might be right that pvp servers are going to ironically have worse world pvp. We’ll see how things pan out over the next few weeks.
Have you ever rolled a PVE server? If not, you have no idea what your talking about.
It’s picking up on Antish too. It’s only a matter of time before Auberdine and the Crossroads get daily action. Flight Master killing low life’s live on PVE servers too. And they usually die easily when the defenders arrive.
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yeah, if you never start a fight that’s how it goes.
How can I “learn” if no-one explains it to me? Can’t you explain without being condescending or insulting me?
Of course I know that opposing-faction players kill NPCs on PVE servers. Killing opposite faction questgivers is a favorite form of “griefing” lower-level toons who need them to progress. Attacking an enemy city NPCs also happens occasionally.
In 15 years of playing WoW, I’ve never heard anyone call that “WPvP”. So the only thing I have not “learned” is how YOU use that term.
Killing NPCs is not “player vs. player”. That only happens when a group of high-level players arrives to fight the group of high-level players who are attacking the NPCs. I’ve seen that happen 2 times in 15 years of play. I don’t consider 2 events in 15 years a different set of rules that we should call “WPvP”. Do you call dueling “WPvP”? I’ve seen that happen a lot.
You haven’t been paying attention then. A few nights ago on Bloodsail Buccaneers, a PVE-RP server Alliance attacked Crossroads. A lot of Alliance. A lot of Horde then got together. Soon the raids were moving from zone to zone taking over different enemy towns. It started with flagged players killing NPCs. It’s been consistent on all the PVE-RP servers I’ve played on since vanilla.
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The world can always use more conspiracy theories, I suppose.
On a PvE server you have to convince the opposite faction to fight. If you raid Orgrimmar and kill all the auctioneers, it is going to elicit a response.
If you show up to Orgrimmar and start killing Thrall you should expect people to try to stop you. In fact, a raid on a capital city will cause dozens of players to hearth back to Orgrimmar to engage the invaders. In the end both sides will inevitably get some hk’s.
Since this is the only way to get honor, anyone trying to rank spends a lot time each day trying to find people to raid cities to coerce the opposite side into PvP.
On a PvP server in phase 2, a rogue doing nothing but killing people at flight points, or wandering around ungoro, could get rank 14 easier than someone actually trying to organize a large PvP battle. The ideal honor-farming group would be 1-3 people.
Also, since PvP backets are based on the PvP pool(not the number of players), one of the goals of a ranker on a PvE server is to get as many players on his faction the necessary 15 hk’s a week. So organizing orgrimmar raids widens the pvp pool, making it easier to rank.
As a consequence, not only is the PvP on PvE servers healthier overall, it is far more social than PvP on a PvP server.
Once battlegrounds are added though it changes the whole dynamic, since PvE’ers can just get their honor from BG’s, and BG’s are better honor-per-hour than ganking. This is especially true if Blizzard moves premades to a separate queue.
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I never understood this disdain that pvpers have for pve servers when it does not affect them at all.
Why do you think a player should be forced to pvp?
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Especially when pvpers cry more about pvp than pve-ers.
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No one wanted to destroy PvP for others. Blizz responded to over whelming player complaints from those who decided they made a mistake rolling on a PvP server. The better solution, imo, was to allow free transfers off PvP to Pve servers. Then merge PvP servers into how ever many were needed to serve the number of players left.
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