Try it again. Still not reading my first post correct
Not going to take a video footage to prove my point. So don’t really care about your trust issues.
It shouldn’t be possible for unskilled players doing wellfare keys to easily obtain the best gear in the game. The current system is very fair in my opinion, I’d say even generous because 20s aren’t as difficult as raid but can still offer the same level of gear.
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The point of the change was to remove the welfare vault items.
Raid is easier this tier.
Just make the highest mythic pluses drop normal raid equivalent ilvl gear. I’m frankly tired of doing mythic keys and waiting to get an invite in a pug because I don’t have mythic key friends. Put the better loot in raids, I only do mythic pluses for the loot.
Nah raiding is boring. I’m fine with good quality loot in m+. Also it’s been already nerfed
I don’t mind a challenge. But when it gets into high keys it becomes a job and stressful, especially with stupid people. Real life is stressful enough and I hate the game feeling like a job to get badass gear. I kind of miss like it was when mythic pluses first came out. Just my 2 cents
It’s easier to get into a raid than farm a bunch of low keys to get into a high key because of io. Heck takes too much time getting into a damn 11 after getting declined forever.
Yet nothing changed. Now they’re just getting carried to keys they didn’t earn and you have people with gear doing less damage than people were at the start of the expansion. Pugging this season is literally insufferable.
Yeah true can relate to it. After ksh I don’t see any reason to push keys. That’s why I loved +15 weekly vault with my friends and guild mates. It was something fun.
Sad I currently don’t have the time to help not so skilled players anymore. But I think they will realize this soon
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You can still do a weekly +15 key if you want; you have not been deprived of that option AND it’s easier than ever.
But giving your request the benefit of the double, let’s compare the two reward outcomes and systems.
In SL, if you did +15s you would get a reward comparable to the non-buffed ilvl slots from mythic raid. The raid would topend at 233, but you would get 226, or the Mythic baseline. If you could get KSM, you could upgrade gear up to 220 outside of GV.
A weekly GV 15 would yield the mythic baseline ilvl, and the non-GV upgrades would cap two ilvl tiers lower. That’s 226 from GV vs 220. Pre valor uncapping, you basically couldn’t hit this upgrade across the board unless you’re running 15s actively; you cannot run anything below a 15 to even conceivably get to this ilvl across the board with just M+.
In DF, the Mythic baseline ilvl is 444, or a weekly +18 key. This means that to get the mythic baseline ilvl, you need to do a bit higher than a +15 BUT you can now get a GV ilvl upgrade higher, at a +20; you have a higher top end than was even possible before, which is a net win. In exchange for a bit more work you gain an extra high end. Now let’s compare the upgrade system itself. If you can do ONLY 11s, you’ll gravitate towards 437 item level and you don’t need to wait for the few months in for valor uncap. In fact, even if you’ve kept up on the wyrm cap to date, by next week EVERYONE can be 437 if they wish; this would be at a point of time around 1.5 months earlier than the valor system uncapping.
You don’t get a 444 for a +15, but you can still get them in a season where a +18 at this stage is still easier than a +15 in S1 and S2 of SL.
In exchange for roughly the same practical difficulty, you get access to +1 ilvl tier of upgrade you didn’t have before, and you get the KSM level upgrade threshold without needing to touch a 15 at all.
As in, someone who couldn’t or hadn’t been able to do KSM before now gets the KSM upgrade track, and can max it out WAY faster than the old system.
But if you COULD do the 15/16 threshold, you can also access 441 from raw upgrades. You have an extra ilvl tier of upgrades available.
And with crafted gear, you can also access 447 loot, which you couldn’t do before. As of next week, you get 3 of your 5 free sparks, but ultimately you get 5 slots at 447 accessible at a minimum.
You are able to craft gear at the +1 ilvl tier range from your prior maximum, for barely any effort above your old threshold.
Trading off a +15 reward under the old system for a +18 of the new system is trivial in exchange for the massively speeding up and empowering the gearing experience.
And again, if you can sit on +15 keys now, you’ll still be just below what you could have been before BUT months faster
Sounds like a skill issue with your friends/guildies, I see no reason Blizzard needs to lower it and trivialize raids even more for people who can just get good.
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Wish I could pug into 15+ but no, I have to do a bunch of low keys to increase my stupid io 
For what it’s worth the dungeon finder wasn’t in at this point during actual Wrath either.
Its not the key systems fault, its your fault. you just said you are to busy.
The old system of only having to time 15s for a chance at mythic-level raid loot was awesome. It gave the more casual playerbase something to look forward to every reset.
If you want an actual answer to this question the lead encounter designer made a forum post about this a while back Differentiating M+ as a Gameplay Mode - #2 by MattVi-1486
In short:
To be completely clear: I’ve never liked the vault change, and have been complaining about it since it was implemented. Not because I can’t do 20s, I can do them on the first week, but I have friends who can’t.
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No, it’s already absurdly easy to gear up. If you want mythic quality gear then you should have to do difficult content to obtain it.
You can still do +15s and be rewarded with gear applicable to your skill level.
And now with the way the upgrade system works, the only thing people need to do is complete 16s for the currency and 17s for items that can be upgraded to 441. The current system already hands out high level gear for very little effort.
My post is not about skill.