#PullTheRipcord Blizzard, the flaws of Covenants have already been exposed

[Oakenshroot-durotan]

Dump some gasoline on this fire, but call it an RPG element and it’ll turn into cool, quenching water.

It just works!

[Gnomenclatur-detheroc]

@Oakenshroot-durotan

The right answer is not “make it worse.” It’s not a difficult concept to grasp.

I’m not convinced it will be qualitatively “worse” though. As you yourself said, things won’t ever be balanced in an absolute sense. And yet you can do virtually any content as any class now. And in SL I think that is still going to be the case. So really, its not worse.

[Tjphess-zuljin]

mfw opening up the player powers (not covenants) solves everything

mfw some dumbos think a 3min cd spell with no visual they press once per fight cause its not even that good in this scenario is a very impactful and immersive rpg element

LMAO

#PullTheRipcord

[Silvervolt-emerald-dream]

@Demonsong-barthilas

@Karynn-greymane

@Demonsong-barthilas

This precisely. Covenants are essentially a removal of choice rather then an addition.

Only on these forums would making a choice between options you’re given mean you didn’t have a choice.

No, only these forums would intentionally misunderstand a topic then try to tear down a strawman.

I’ve come to the conclusion that these folks don’t really understand to what is going on, tbh.

[Silvervolt-emerald-dream]

you’re supposed to those a tank on propane on it…

[Monori-bleeding-hollow]

Because without taking into account all the conduits soulbind and legendaries blizzard is going to be trying to balance 144 specs in essence. Now some covenants abilities make very little impact others are 50% of throughput now add on the conduits soulbinds and legendaries and you have a system that basically can’t be balanced. Some combinations will end up wildly overpowered while others will end up beyond trash.

Thing is unlike azerite or corruption you won’t be able to farm up and easily change them. It’s going to be an absolute nightmare and even from an rp perspective it doesn’t make sense. We literally aid all covenants while leveling why would we just stop doing that at max level we are all fighting the jailer after all. We are all in it together for shadowlands why in the world would we not be able to help/receive aid from more than just our chosen covenant.

[Oakenshroot-durotan]

@Gnomenclatur-detheroc

@Oakenshroot-durotan

The right answer is not “make it worse.” It’s not a difficult concept to grasp.

I’m not convinced it will be qualitatively “worse” though. As you yourself said, things won’t ever be balanced in an absolute sense. And yet you can do virtually any content as any class now. And in SL I think that is still going to be the case. So really, its not worse.

That’s not even in the same galaxy as the point I was making.

Gonna Barney-style it:

• 36 specs today

• small number of those specs are the best

• 144 spec/Covenants in SL

• small number of those specs are the best

If small number 2 is not 4 times bigger than small number 1, there will be less chance of any one choice being “best” in Shadowlands.

Math.

Notice I said nothing about whether you can complete content or not in any of my posts.

[Zhanli-wyrmrest-accord]

Hey, if I go necrolord I get a green flame shock sometimes that just makes my hand look like I dipped it in a public toilet as its graphic.

That’s some RPG right there!

[Froom-stormrage (Froom)]

@Karynn-greymane

What’s wrong with story informing gameplay? You’ve accepted it literally in all other parts of the game.

Nah, I thought it was dumb when I did the wrong quest in TBC and was locked as a Frost mage all expansion, and I think locking covenants is dumb now.

#PullTheRipcord

[Demonsong-barthilas (Demonsong)]

@Gnomenclatur-detheroc

@Monori-bleeding-hollow

Their current choice is going to make it even harder for non optimal people to get into groups.

I haven’t really seen a convincing argument as to why that is true. Why is it that you believe that?

That’s been explained a few times now.

This is an MMO where you rely on other players to succeed. Other players, like your guild mates will expect you to have certain abilities so that you can use them to progress a fight.

Hence if you do content where you rely on others, it won’t actually be your choice which covenant you pick if you want to continue relying on those guildmates.

[Oakenshroot-durotan]

@Silvervolt-emerald-dream

@Demonsong-barthilas

@Karynn-greymane

@Demonsong-barthilas

This precisely. Covenants are essentially a removal of choice rather then an addition.

Only on these forums would making a choice between options you’re given mean you didn’t have a choice.

No, only these forums would intentionally misunderstand a topic then try to tear down a strawman.

I’ve come to the conclusion that these folks don’t really understand to what is going on, tbh.

Absolutely they don’t haha. Look at the person arguing with me over a simple question of proportions. Information passes over and around them like a smooth flowing river of refreshing RPG choices.

[Gnomenclatur-detheroc]

I get that you believe things will be harder to balance but you didn’t actually answer the question of why this will make it harder for people to get groups. Things aren’t balanced now and people still manage. If you believe that there will be large groups of players considered too sub-optimal to invite, why wouldn’t this larger block of players cause the formation of groups specifically for their own ilk?

[Tjphess-zuljin]

@Gnomenclatur-detheroc

I get that you believe things will be harder to balance but you didn’t actually answer the question of why this will make it harder for people to get groups.

I can log in right now, queue up for like 20 +15s groups and most of them or all will decline them cause my class isn’t the meta

there’s your answer

[Gnomenclatur-detheroc]

@Tjphess-zuljin

there’s your answer

So it is currently hard to get into certain groups for some people. I agree.

[Tjphess-zuljin]

and then Covenants add an extra layer on top of that, which is multiplying this degeneracy even more

[Gnomenclatur-detheroc]

But adding people to the pool of people who want to form groups but may be considered off-meta would make it easier for those people, not harder.

[Demonsong-barthilas (Demonsong)]

@Gnomenclatur-detheroc

But adding people to the pool of people who want to form groups but may be considered off-meta would make it easier for those people, not harder.

So the groups who have trouble clearing a +7 ?

[Oakenshroot-durotan]

@Gnomenclatur-detheroc

But adding people to the pool of people who want to form groups but may be considered off-meta would make it easier for those people, not harder.

It will make it harder, not easier. Those people who are being demoted into the non-meta space are going to be competing with the people who are already there.

[Chilblains-greymane]

@Demonsong-barthilas

Other players, like your guild mates will expect you to have certain abilities so that you can use them to progress a fight.

Why are you acting like not having certain covenant is going to make you completely nonviable?

Sure PuGs will demand nonsense, but they have always demanded nonsense.

This is like requiring ilvl 450 for content that drops ilvl 420 loot. It’s overkill, when in reality that content can be played by a player that knows what they’re doing in with a 405-410 ilvl.

I’d hate to be in a guild that requires overqualifications.

Not having the perfect covenant for one thing isn’t going to make or break the game.

[Gnomenclatur-detheroc]

@Demonsong-barthilas

So the groups who have trouble clearing a +7

@Tjphess-zuljin

I can log in right now, queue up for like 20 +15s groups and most of them or all will decline them cause my class isn’t the meta

Something tells me this guy can probably handle a +7. But yes, all kinds of people might be considered off meta, including those struggling with a +7.