Hello, I am curious about prot pally mitigation as I don’t have a geared one this tier.
From my understanding:
Passive DR: prot war has 15% for physical dmg and 21% for magical dmg. This does’t include 8% from thunderblast hero talent, which has very high uptime. How much DR does prot pally get from consec ?
Block: Prot war has 100% block chance with around 30% being critical block. Can prot pally cover 100% mitigation table with dodge+parry+block ?
defensive cooldowns: I think prot pally has an advantage thank to bubble taunt.
EHP: while prot war has more health, in combat prot pally should have more armor.
So I am unsure about this.
I would love if any geared prot pally gave their stat numbers and opinions about prot war and prot pally in term of dmg mitigation.
Word of Glory: 15% Block Chance with 1 Talent Point (50% → 65%); 30% with 2 Talent Points.
Devotion Aura: 3% Damage Reduction
Holy Shield: Ability to Passively Block Spells
Avenger’s Shield:
10% Block Chance (50% → 60%)
5% Parry Chance per target hit up to 5 (18% → 43% with Avenger’s Shield)
With Everything Listed Combined (No Defensive CDs)
625 ilvl
Strength: 60,444 (7.8% Parry)
Stamina: 452,802 (9,056,040 HP)
Armor: 230,836 (I’ll have to get back to you on this one)
Critical Strike: 17% (7.49% Parry)
Haste: 36%
Mastery: 28% (25% Block)
Versatility: 6% (3.46% Damage Reduction)
Dodge: 3% (Base)
Parry: 46%
Block: 75% (36.68% Damage Reduction)
Consecration: 12% Damage Reduction
Devotion Aura: 3% Damage Reduction
Holy Shield: Ability to Passively Block Spells
Shield of the Righteous: 2 Set Bonus 3% Damage Reduction
I think as of right now there’s no denying that Warrior is in a better place than Paladin. We could see some of the gap closing tomorrow, but probably not enough to overtake.
this is pretty much equal to shield block + critical block
same as 15% DR from defensive stance
Overall, I feel like prot pally is tankier than prot war. But prot war has smoother dmg intake thank to bigger hp, ignore pain, and spell reflect.
But there are some annoying knock back abilities this tier, how do you deal with them ?
I think the major challenge with Paladin is the initial entry. As you can see, there’s a massive difference from our base level stats vs rolling. Once we get everything rolling it feels good and using defensive at the start help get us there.
Which ones in particular? The 2nd boss in Dawnbreaker I back up against the fountain all the way then tap forward once or twice. The knock will bump me into the fountain and back down. If you are right up against it then it flies you far back.
For GB Dragon, tank against the wall. There’s a couple strats to avoid the tornadoes.
2nd boss in Dawn, I usually move away from the boss to a house wall, so dps can keep dpsing the boss
last boss in GB, same knock back effect with a crap load of tentacles blocking your way back. On war, I just charge back, but I am not sure how to deal with it as pally.
it’s also tough for prot war as it doesn’t have rage on pull. Usually I have to start with shield wall to live through the first few seconds.
I used to do that, but I like being able to see better. I also don’t pull the spider in front of the boss in my route so it works out better for me to use the fountain. DPS can be on the boss the entire time since I found a way to not get knocked.
Most of the time, the circle closes in near a wall so I just make sure I’m pointed against an open spot. I move into the boss’ hit box so it doesn’t actually knock me that far.
It does help to have Bubble to clear away dense groupings of tentacles for the group though.
There’s only 2 super scary pulls for me so far and it’s the Dawnbreaks 2nd miniboss and the Lava lieutenants in GB. The rest I can manage with just using short CD defensives which will be back up for the next pack.
PPal is nowhere close to tankier than PWar. First of all, mitigation works as a check vs hit, where each attack is rolled against dodge, then parry, then block, then against your armor/existing shielding. Its not all on the same roll system like it was in the first few iterations, where defense stat, uncrushable, and the like were needed to tank proficently.
Where does that leave us? Well, PPal does have better parry against groups/trash, but your ability to block any attack takes a TON of mastery, whereas Warr gets it basically by default by using correct talents and hitting buttons correctly. So, warrior literally never takes a fully unmitigated hit. Period. And they still have passable armor and ignore pain to further mitigate incoming damage.
Now, that said, Warr is easily the tankiest tank at the moment (bear is only one close to them), and pally probably weakest or second weakest, but the gap between the two is huge.
I have to disagree here. Because there are no crushing blows or critical hits, there is no difference between a blocked attack and an attack reduced by high armor. Bear is the very example, it has only high armor with no extra block/dodge/parry.
My 620 war has 55% DR from armor, sosari has 65% from armor. Basically, sosari takes 20% dmg physical less than me on a normal white hit. Coupling with extremely high parry and block chance, pally should have higher dmg mitigation base.
The issue with the rumor of pally getting oneshot more often than warrior is likely because of ignore pain and higher health.
I think you fail to understand how block works at a fundamental level. If you block, all additional damage is now assessed against your character. This assessment checks your absorbs and armor.
So, your average pally gets hit for 1000 dmg and fails to parry or block. They then take 60% less damage because of armor. Thus, 400 damage to your hp pool.
By contrast, warrior fails to parry. They cannot miss a block if they are playing even passably well, so they block the hit. So, that 1000 is now 600 of the top (assuming 40% dr on block). From that 600, its now reduced by 50% for your armor (lowballing here), leaving you with 300 damage taken. And thats WITHOUT any ignore pain up, which is also you just playing your warrior terrible because Mountain Thane swims in rage. If you have ignore pain up, you’re likely taking more like 150-200 damage from that 1000 hit.
Huge difference.
(Also, side note, bear gets substantial dodge from agility, not sure where youre getting that they just get punched and depend 100% on armor)
I think Paladin base mitigation is better. The thing that makes the difference is:
Ignore Pain which reduces damage by 50% with zero CD
Spell Reflect on a 25s CD.
These allows Warriors to have heavy Defensives up for nearly every Boss Tank Buster that’s stronger than our Defensives with longer CDs.
Higher HP Pool.
We have more Parry than warriors especially during trash pulls, higher armor, and Block chance can be 90% with 2 points into a Talent instead of the 1 I have in the example which drops it down to 75%. It’s the externals that makes them more viable atm.
Now, some of this does change after today so we’ll see how it impacts us in practice.
You are mistaking here. In a very specific scenario, where a prot pally gets all the worst RNG, then prot war seems to have better overall mitigation. But overall, you have absurdly high parry chance, block chance, and armor. All combined together would make prot pally take less dmg than warrior. Ignore pain is a form of self-heal making warrior’s dmg intake smoother; and prot pally’s dmg intake looks spikier because of that. However, you have real self-heal from AS absorb shield, and WoGs.
In short, warrior has a smoother dmg intake profile for sure, which gives healers a leeway to cover them. On contrast, despite having very strong mitigation base, prot pally dmg intake profile is a bit spikier, which makes it more vunerable to oneshot if you make mistakes.