They had the ability to do both. Most ranged abilities had a minimum. It created a dead zone.
In the name of qol and esports, rpg mechanics went away. Melee surv is a bit of a throwback. It’s primarily melee but does have significant ranged output and the ability to eagle.
Survival has become the poor man’s Beast Mastery. Well done Blizzard, Well done indeed.
All survival needs is a boost in its Single target damage. Our aoe is pretty darn good and the only thing I would change is maybe increase the debuff time on our bombs so we can chain more attacks into them. Such short windows to stack 3 bleeds or rotate around to maintain the poison with the bomb refresh.
I dunno if anything would ever help them in a raid setting. But I know in mythic+ we’re pretty good all things consider, but we do have to work harder for our damage compared to marks and our poor ST shows.
Deff no flexibility in our build either. All but one legendary feels bad and we can’t pick any non bomb options otherwise our aoe would be mediocre too. But I do like the extra bomb and the debuffs from the final talent so that’s not a big deal.
I’m only subbed for Classic right now didn’t even buy SL I’m aware of the dead zone, (leveling my hunter as I type this on my 2nd computer *and played one the first time around with my warlock) but back to the discussion you jumped into was SV ever intended to me a Melee spec. *MM and BM can melee or do damage in Melee range but does not make them a melee spec had (even playing classic survival’s 30 point talent is Wyvern sting does not sound to melee). (in WOD or MOP I believe you could still equ them but it’s just for mostly being silly), *would you be happy if putting a raid together and needed more range and you had all SV come in to fill in the spot?
Not really in Warth it is best to spec for SV hunter and get high crt (over 50%) and switch to MM once your armor penetration is above 50%. That’s for ICC
I never said you’re baddie, i said i would be the baddie.
Specs are derivative of a base class. They are not licenses to remove critical parts of the class.
In the same manual it says that Priests are primarily spellcasters. Does this mean it makes sense for one of its specs to not be a spellcaster?
LMAO, bruh, he wasn’t even talking to you nor was he criticising anyone. He was upset that an option that was fun to him was tuned badly. Did you quote the wrong post or are you really just this insecure?
I’m perfectly fine with pointing out your own involvement in this class, however. It doesn’t look like you do much of anything on this toon you post on and you’re in mostly questing gear with only level 16 renown (i.e. not even the whole covenant story). It seems to me you aren’t a Hunter main nor do you even play your Hunter toon much at all beyond hitting level 60 but you post from one because you think it gives you more credibility in Hunter discussions. Accurate?
Are you sure you’re quoting the right replies? You’re making unhinged rants against posts that have nothing to do with what you’re saying.
Are you also still pretending that the specs got more similar over time? Look at how the 3 specs differed in Classic. Are you really going to tell me that they were unique then but not unique in WotLK and beyond? How detached from reality can you be?
So it’s the “I played since Vanilla” card, then? Well, aside from the fact that we already established that you don’t really play this class, I’ve been playing since Vanilla and Legion’s changes were the worst spec changes. They had no idea what they were doing and failed to make any of the 3 specs compelling, and most of their worked seemed to be aimed at taking away everything Hunters enjoyed about the class. Part of growing up is realising that “unique” does not always equate to “good” and that chasing uniqueness above all else can lead to major design errors.
You’ve gone at length to defend a major rework to Survival that was explicitly aimed at making it fun only for a specific niche of players rather than the broader Hunter playerbase. At least try to be internally consistent.
It still lacks a ranged weapon and therefore is not sufficient. It primarily fights in melee.
It was actually because the melee mechanics diluted the class identity and worsened the experience.
No, it isn’t. Survival was not primarily melee and did not deliberately stick to melee range before Legion. Melee Survival is a revisionist fever dream.
Melee Survival lovers tend to distract from the spec’s failure by projecting its shortcomings into the past and pretending that Survival has always been this way. Many of them also just didn’t play back then and are using their ignorance as a platform. Ask our buddy Urmog here about that.
I don’t think they were talking about you at all man. I think they were just lamenting the current PVE state of the spec but wanted to play it anyways because they enjoy it.
THat is the key term partially melee centric but mostly range centric . You use the partially aspect as if that was the main focus of the spec back then and it wasn’t it was a range spec with melee abilities to help it get back in to range when opponents or npcs got into the old range dead zone.
Can’t use Lore characters as a basis for playable specs .
Thrall wore plate as a shaman and shaman gear is mail
Anduin wears plate and uses a sword . Priest can only wear cloth and can’t use swords.
If anything if they were going to use Rexxar for any spec it should of been Beast Master seeing that was what he was from WC3 until the Legion retconn.
The old if the truth doesn’t support your agenda perpetuate lie mantra.
yea my man i dont think youre quoting the right people, or youre going crazy and need to take a time out on the forums
In all honesty the biggest issue with melee survival is that it thematically makes very little sense. Whichever Dev came up with using survival as the melee spec should probably be fired, if they were not already. Traps, explosives, gadgets and poisons should have logically gone with ranged, no one throws a grenade in their own face (unless they are suicidal).
Thematically beast mastery would have made far more sense as the melee spec, fighting side by side with your partner(s). Calling in backup animals etc.
That would leave marks as the sniper-style it currently has.
I love playing Survival but at the moment, yeah I don’t know they seem … lacking?
To be honest, I also felt Survival should be able to have Exotic / Spirit Beasts at their side – I mean they’re fighting RIGHT BESIDE THEM, I’d say that’s a deep level of respect right there, moreso than beast masters provide in a way.
Note, before complaints hit: Beast Mastery Hunters would still be BM hunters, they’re still a unique spec etc; exotic beasts isn’t their ‘only’ thing.
SV is already borrowing heavily from BM though. Does it really need to borrow more? Or could it build up the bond between hunter and pet without taking from BM with something new?
give hunters a dark ranger dot/debuff ranged spec that old survival was. and turn whatever disgusting mess survival is currently into a proper dragoon. spear using mail wearer who jumps around the place with high mobility and lots of dragon themed moves.
its like everyone at blizz lost all signs of creativity when it comes to class design. out of every MMO ive played, class design in wow is no contest the worst of everything on the market. literally every other MMO on the market has infinitely better class design than wow. the character rigged movement is very high quality compared to a lot of other MMOs, with i think only BDO having the gold standard of character movement animations. but actual nuts and bolts of class design from how they are built and played is absolutely deplorable comparatively.
blizz need to just move the current team on to idk hearthstone or something and actually hire some real talent for there class designers. monks have had multi year to half decade long bugs that still arnt resolved.
They have a few spells that BM have but I’d hardly say that’s ‘heavily’. But that being said, a lot of classes have some shared abilities / aspects. Additionally speaking, BM is ranged, Survival isn’t.
On that note though, I wouldn’t mind if there was a Survival-hunter specific quest / scenario that had to be earned to obtain the skill to be able to tag along with the exotic / spirit beasts - like Mage Tower, but different.
I mean, they took kill command and they took spirit bond which was literally already a BM only thing since classic. What more does BM have to give up to SV hunter?
I’m well aware.
Edit: I just think there could be a more creative solution to build a bond between hunter and pet rather than taking more from BM. Keep in mind that SV was changed in the first place because it was apparently too similar to MM. The solution shouldn’t be to borrow more from BM which comes across as hypocritical to the reasoning for the rework in the first place.
They gave Explosive Shot to MM which was a Survival-only thing for a long while too. 
I just don’t really see how giving Surv exotic or spirit beastswould be a huge deal. I’d understand building a bond between hunter & pet, and I agree on that note. I’d like there to be some kind of catch, sacrifice (Perhaps put it on the talent table on par with other create abilities) , or earn (Like Mage Tower scenario) to obtain.
If you feel Surv having Exotic / Spirit beasts would be taking from BM / would ruin its entire identity, then the issue isn’t survival — It’s BM. And if that was the case then the spec should be scrapped and recycled.
Survival is now a weird option. I mean, is it a warrior? it has a pet but the damage is just so-so, not really worth talking about. What do you bring? traps? all hunters have traps, massive aoe damag? MM does better, being melee puts you at risk while MM has the most range of all specs baring boomkins, single target damage? but your main thing, bombs and stuff, are for AoE, not single target, and in aoe MM beats you with just 2 buttons, what to do?
For Survival, they should have better traps, like improved explosive, improved freezing, or tar trap, so you get something out of a survival hunter. Giving them cheat deaths (survival 0_0 am i right?) or aspects to buff the raid or get bonuses of combinations, like “get X stat and Y effect if your teammate is another Survival hunter or Z class”, making them worth bringing for raids and giving a reason to exist without just adding T% damage increase to their abilities.