Sounds like you havent actually played as an underperfoming class else you would know you can still get into groups, at worst you have to deal with higher amount of rejection so Ion calling it an imagined fear is right.
Community perceptions being dumb and wrong and not inviting an spriest for example on a +6 only shows how ignorant some people and how they dont understand the game, but sooner or later you still find groups even as underperforming specs and we know very well a guild can also be another option.
If you are good, you can make any spec work even in pugs, and in addition you can always start pugs but going purely through a pug perspective that joins others? You can still get into groups if you try.
If they are willing to level 4 of each because they cant play without being optimal even though they arent anywhere near world first it sounds to me that they arent great players and just reroll because they would be garbage at an underperfoming spec, I ve seen enough terrible DHs in m+ and I know most of them just rerolled cuz they heard it is the fotm yet even being Fotm doesnt make them good players.
Which is why I started making my own pugs which succeed even with and spriest and destro lock on tol dagor, why? Because when I checked their rio I didnt give a damn about class or score, I was looking to identify if they are skilled or not instead of inviting n#12525 noob reroller DH who gets outdpsed by an spriest in aoe
If they leave, then they should leave since if you cant play unless you are always optimal, Ion confirmed the game isnt made for you.
This is not true and the single most misleading statement being spread.
What combination of spec/talents/covenant/soulbind/conduit will be “best” is going to vary for each class depending on their team/group/raid composition.
For example - on a necrotic week, a team with multiple ways of getting the tanks stacks to drop may not need their boomkin to go Force of Nature; but if they’re lacking ways - then treants would be very meaningful. There’s no “100% right” choice here - it varies based on a lot of factors.
The same applies for raids and bosses. As a boomkin on an add fight, Twin moons and Fury of Elune may be useful if the raid composition is lacking aoe. But if there’s plenty of other options for aoe coupled with a high need for single target boss damage, then stellar flare and shooting stars may be the better option. Again - there’s no “100% right way” to set your character up because it depends on a lot of factors like composition, strategy, etc.
Sounds like you have no idea about meta, because good luck seeing builds that tell you to use shadow insight, not use the EP essence as main or have 5x expedient and only 2x severe while a high crit build is far more meta.
But looks like you know little.
Why would I math when there are sims, and even the sims tell me if i wanted higher dps I should use other things which I am not using and never will use ;^)
Same, seems pretty clear that you either didnt see the interview or ignored what Ion was saying.
I wasn’t commenting about the levelling process so not sure why you bring this up. Leveling a such a small part of WoW right now and it’s only going to be shorter in Shadowlands. I was commenting about the modes you refer to like arena and mythic dungeons as well as raids where the elite would love to have a tournament realm where everyone gets identical gear and skill options to pick from so they can compete on equal footing. That’s essentially what you get with games likes overwatch and league of legends and Ion did make this comparison (Every Tracer is the same). WoW has never been like that, but recent homogenization of classes and the use of borrowed power are examples of how they have tried to create equal footing for competition and end up killing class identity and uniqueness. They are now trying to bring back customization to make things interesting again.
I do agree that you shouldn’t be Uber gimped switching between modes of play like PVP, mythics, raiding , etc only because you picked soulbinds for one mode and can’t switch. I think for one particular class and spec you should be able to easily switch modes. But I think switching classes roles/specs and not being super optimal is okay.
I wish they made these customization options like covenant sub-abilities last longer than one expansion. That would be cool.
Sort of a self-defeating prophecy. X is good enough but it’s not as good as Y so its “X won’t get in” and lo and behold people make it happen. People bring it on themselves because they KNOW that, for example, Windwalker is fine. They have to know it. But DH is slightly better, so suddenly Windwalker is garbage.
Let’s face it though it’s going to happen. People want to minimize their chances of failure and maximize their chances of success. I can’t think of a way around that and no matter how much the devs will try they can’t stop people from thinking that way.
Well when you make a covenant in real life, you are making a commitment, and indeed taking an oath to uphold one end of a bargain in exchange for something in return.
I suppose people just don’t like the idea of having to make a covenant in order to acquire additional power. But, if you think about it that’s how covenants in real life work. If you break them then the other party doesn’t uphold their part of the bargain.
First and foremost Blizzard is designing a role playing game. There not in the business of designing nameless systems so everyone can be 100% optimal for every encounter; that’s not wow. The covenant design is outside of that scope. And Blizzard isn’t designing content around the expectation of players needing 4 characters that are allied to each covenant.
It’s people coming to their own conclusions that in order to play their content these types of things must be done. Which isn’t true. Will your character not be 100% optimal all of the time, yes. But that was never the goal to begin with.
Perhaps it was a mistake for them to design covenants. But what other role playing design is there, that affords you borrowed power, with out any sort of commitment?
It’s not imagined if it happens. If you actually get rejected more often than accepted.
And it’s not a good feeling to know you being rejected is completely out of your control.
That’s not dumb or even wrong. If the raid has a higher chance of success by not taking that inadequate spec.
You fundamentally misunderstand the human desire for risk assessment and success. I don’t fault anyone for wanting to get X done in Y time. If that’s the perceived best timeline for obtaining what you want from the game.
And not everyone has the time nor patience to struggle for hours with a weak link that has zero control over their being a weak link. We fought and still fight for years to get underrepresented specs fixed for content such as M+ and this is only going to make that worse.
Good is something you know. Good isn’t something pick up groups know. Also, good doesn’t always cover the deficiencies. That’s why I said in many of these cases it’s just not in the player’s hands to get better if they can’t.
You have an unhealthy optimistic view of what happens given the historical evidence to the contrary.
Irrelevant. Because they rerolled to be competent in the content they enjoy and ARE competent because the class is utterly broken in M+ content.
So therefore FOTM does make them at least perceptively better than if they played something they have no hope of doing good at.
First TD isn’t a movement heavy dungeon. Not like AZ, KR or Underrot. I’m not surprised you did fine with a destro lock on TD. I don’t deny some dungeons are better for the underperforming specs than others.
The problem with warlock in BFA was all their specs were garbage for most of the M+ dungeons. At least heading into 8.3. I can’t speak for now as I quit soon after.
And I confirmed with Ion and their crew that I’m checked out. Pantheon will be my new home when it launches. I only come here to talk once in awhile and watch the clown show.
Preach wasn’t being 100% truthful about his motivations, he first claimed it wasn’t about switching covenants willy-nilly, then he went on to explain that he wanted to switch around to try things out.
Obviously he is taking this stand because it benefits his stream and his playstyle, and that is to roll many characters and switch covenant/spec according to the challenge presented. That’s just ridiculous.
He also claimed that this was about what causal players wanted, but it looks like most casual players are fine with covenants. He knows that Blizzard is sympathetic to casual players based on past decisions, he’s very clever.
The other way of looking at it: You are now expected to swap to the best Covenant because you can do so without consequence. Playing a Frost Mage instead of Fire Mage in Mythic+? You’re making it harder than it needs to be.
I’d be okay with removing player power from Covenants, but I’m not willing to forsake their original vision quite yet.
Covenant choice is about character identity. High skill players and streamers can’t min/max every single thing in the game and they’re just going to have to accept that.
If you’re the type of player that is ok with playing in an inferior manner - then you likely already play with other similar players with the same mindset that won’t discriminate against you.
If a player wants to do competitive content, and they’re not expecting to be carried, then they’re usually happy to do what they can to help the group succeed.