Inconsistency in logic is a clear sign of biased thinking. Why is it the same people saying players only want to farm honor and rep as quickly as possible also say that players will make the choice to play long games.
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You are locked in a delusion that a zerg would survive moving up the map in pre-1.8 AV. They would be whittled down to nothing and scattered amongst the map. Then the following would happen:
- Collecting ram Hides
- Collecting wolf Hides
- Fighting Korrak for the epic quest loot
- Attempting the quests in the caves for the battle standard quest
- Attempting to bypass minefields
- Capturing enemy mines
- Rescuing flight masters from enemy territory
- Killing enemy players for turnin items to strengthen guards, summon elemental gods
All are things that generate PVP situations.
After a BG or 2, people would get the point that zerging doesn’t work in pre-1.8 AV, and would instead learn to Peel The Onion.
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“Well 1.5 is just harder.” That’s not an example of anything that forces either team to have to fight each other.
But if as a team it can be done in half an hour, which is likely all it would take if neither side stopped to fight one another, to fight your way through all the NPCs, cap all the towers/bunkers then kill the general, and that win speed is more efficient then doing AV for 3 days, why are you not going to push for the fastest possible win?
You are locked under the delusion that a zerg has to only run by the NPCs. That all 40 players on a team can’t zerg mob by mob and kill everything they come across.
Having half the raid solo PvEing in a battleground is infuriating. That was the main reason why 1.5 took forever, because you could only ever get 2/3rds of the group to help with objectives.
I feel you are just completely on a different page from everyone else. Then to come and say something like that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
Try to re-read what people have said, you are not comprehending the points being made.
You don’t seem to want to acknowledge that reinforcements in no way enabled the ability to race to the generals while bypassing all of the PVP and content on the way.
The only thing that generates pvp situations is players wanting pvp, if players don’t want pvp they’ll be able to avoid it regardless of version.
I never said they did, what I said was that reinforcements made zerging the only viable strategy. Which is significantly different.
If both teams agree to avoid each other, yes. However, there’s plenty of opportunity to defend against a zerg. Many horde players will tell you that Alliance can do this far too efficiently because of the bridge.
You are pulling a dawnspirit and pretending that a race/zerg where the content on the way to the general would be successful in a pre-1.8 AV. Dawnspirit did not play earlier versions of AV so he can be excused for the ignorance of how it actually played out. What is your excuse?
You don’t seem to want to acknowledge that reinforcements punished you for not zerging. All the horde has to do to win a reinforcements game, is turtle at IBGY. Basically a guaranteed win then, but if they do that and nothing but that then the Alliance stop playing AV, because it’s not any fun to do a BG where you have 0 chance of winning.
Lexemic, I’ve been on these forums a long time. I’ve been on online forums since they were invented. I know all the tricks. And I know when someone is dodging a question, changing the subject and deflecting.
I’m making a solid point here. There’s a group of posters in this thread who want 1.12 AV. They simultaneously say that most players (including themselves) simply want to farm AV for honor and rep as quickly as possible. And then they also pull out the argument that, ‘Players will choose to play defense and enjoy the long-term battles.’ Those two statements are contrary. Why? Because it applies two different forms of logic. You can’t say players will look for the path of least resistance and then shun that path.
This is an argument being made by people who know they’re in the wrong, and simply completely change their argument based on what they’re arguing against. Because it’s not about truth, or facts, or reality. It’s about extending a personal agenda.
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And my point is I do not care if 90% of players want the easier route to powerful gear. If 90% of humans eat at McDonalds compared to Ruths Chris, does that mean McDonalds is better food?
I want quality gameplay, not the most luke warm watered down neutered garbage just so 90% of people can get their shiny purples quickly and then vomit.
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You are pulling an idiot and not reading. Or do you really believe in 1.5, that all 40 players against nothing but NPCs, on foot, killing npc group, by npc group could not work their way down the map efficiently? That a single group of NPCs stand a chance against the whole team?
It’s still faster than AB and WSG. I capped multiple characters on rep before 1.8.
Go play WSG/AB if you want to farm quick honor.
Not everyone plays this game just to get little rewards. Some actually play for fun.
This wasn’t the case before, and it wouldn’t be the case again.
Sounds like you’d be happier in the current, racing zerg AV of modern WoW so you can snag yourself some cereal box prizes faster.
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My point is about players taking the path of least resistance, and AV 1.5 making that path not zerging the BG.
Nothing in AV literally forces players to do something, not even reinforcements. It’s a silly requirement to add to this.
There are two reasons, from a standpoint of trying to get rewards, to farm AV: CP for the PvP ranking system, and rep for the vendor rewards.
Once the BG becomes too slow for CP, then immediately it falls out of the running entirely. AB and WSG become the things to do if you want that. Farming the same players over and over again for HKs quickly turns them into being worth 0 CP for the next 24 hours.
Once rep is more quickly gained by doing objectives within the BG rather than rushing the enemy General, then we see zerging is no longer the best route to go.
It’s not about winning. It’s about getting the rewards as fast as possible, which winning is not the only thing that makes progress towards that.
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Reinforcements make it so not zerging is almost certainly a loss, but sure I guess players have the choice to lose.
This is the precise attitude Classic needs to strive to encourage in the players. An easily zergable 1.12 AV does the exact opposite. It plays into the gimme gimme gimme entitlement attitude that infects Current WoW. And sadly, evidently the Classic devs agree with that attitude, as the Blue post says they feel earlier AV had too many NPCs, and those NPCs were too powerful. That really was a shot to the gut.
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It’s also almost certainly a loss to try to turtle in AV 1.12.
and it’s absolutely less efficient for farming rep/CP.
Oh look, it is supreme commander dawnspirit, who has the ability to guide 39 people in a PUG, directing them as an iron glove to do her bidding (Nope, nobody is going to tell her to go pound sand and run forward so they can capture objectives to complete their individual AV quests. Nor are lowbies going to go after their battle standard quests in the caves, or collect rams/wolves) Brave sir Dawnspirit will have complete control.
In before dawnspirit says it is just as easy to do as simply riding north or south to the generals.
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