We can link and look up best PVP rankings for players. So why not add our best M+ season score to the in-game system?
With WoW having an internal IO, it would be great if we could show previous best scores, even if those scores are from prior expansions.
Would be nice if best and current season showed on our characters in-game, even if we are on an alt. This is important more so for cross forms of content, not only for m+ if we are applying on an alt.
(updated 3/5 - I wrote this post as a request but felt after seeing much confusion in replies below I figured I should explain why this is important:
In content where we have few apps its nice to be able to identify players to invite who apply. Especially raid content on alliance side. There are soo many people with no prior tier AOTC or even raid exp who apply in que with 245+ ivl, so we need another way to identify these people to invite, which is IO. Some have great IO but its from BFA and I’m sure they would learn the new raid quickly. It’s all new content anyways for everyone. IO in itself is an achievement and represents player skill even if it’s from prior expansions.
In my opinion it is one of the best ways to determine all around player skill for multiple forms of content. I’ve taken people who had almost no PVP exp but high IO and was able to climb the PVP ladder with them.
I’ve also looked at players who had HIGH bfa IO and almost no shadow lands exp and brought them into a new raid or lower key and they learned the content quickly. I got a few week 1 atoc’s in BFA inviting some players with zero recent raid BFA exp but had high IO. This system has worked incredible well for people using LFG, and having it more viewable in-game rather than going to the site will help us fill groups faster.
Since IO is an internal system, there is no point for our best season to not show, even if its from prior expansions. It will help us identify players to invite so we can fill groups.
I don’t think previous expansion experience translates. Someone could have run +20s in BFA and might be clueless about mechanics and/or affixes in SL.
I still use RIO, the in-game interface is not as as good imo. There’s a lot more to it than raw score.
The score just shows gaming skill. Like someone who got a PVP achieve in legion but came back in shadow lands to try again, they might have a tough time at first, but we can assume they will learn pretty quickly and can handle the game.
I imagine the previous highest m+ score would designate season (S1, etc) and expansion earned.
No one really cares about your “experience” from 4 years ago, it makes you sound washed up and desperate. Dungeons and classes worked different back then, it’s pretty much irrelevant to current day gameplay
Can’t we just assume that they can learn pretty quickly and handle the game while building up a relevant io score in this expansion? There are affix and dungeon details you’re only going to learn by doing, so there’s no reason people should expect you to know them from previous expansion experience without working your way up in current content.
No one cares that someone got glad or world first in MoP. Each season/expansion is a clean slate where you can be the next big guy or fall to the bottom and that’s a good thing.
That’s not the reason. You’re not getting invited to 15 key with no current expansion IO. But you’ll be able to get into 10 with IO from BFA and gear, or might be considered for a raid group if you have the ilvl needed.
This is how raiderio has always been used to see who has gaming experience. Not just current content experience.
In addition, someone who pushes 2k IO once or 3k, might not ever do it again, even in later expansions, but would love a way to see it in game.
If this is how people have been using it then it’s no wonder there are so many people complaining about players leaving groups. IO is not, and never has been, and measure of “gaming experience” or skill. It is, and always has been, a measure of what content you have completed. You can trust that someone who has done a dungeon at +15 on time a number of times probably knows what they’re doing in that dungeon.
No amount of generic “gaming experience” is going to magically infuse you with the specific details of a dungeon, like interrupt priorities, common routes and pulls, priority damage targets, or specific boss responsibilities. Those come from actually doing the dungeons. General gaming experience may help you learn them faster than lesser mortals, but you’re a liability the first time you do a dungeon.
There are feat of strength achievements for all the 15s and each 20, so you have receipts in that form if you’d like them. That is just from SL s2 onward, so you won’t have anything from before, but all the scores before were 3rd party anyway, so there’s no reason to expect that they would be in the game.
Okay. Looking at someone’s IO score alone shows which dungeons they’ve completed on time, and at which level. It says nothing about how. Someone who has timed 15 on every dungeon 100 times has the same score as someone who purchased a carry through each 15 once. And they all have the same score as someone who was carried by friends or guildmates. Assuming that someone is a good player based on a single number with no context is a terrible assumption.
Eventually you’ll reach scores that are high enough where it is unlikely that someone could be boosted or carried, so the score alone is a reliable indicator, but that isn’t true in a general sense.
As I indicated to Hottz, IO can be a good indicator of skill, but it requires a deeper dive into the player’s history to get a context for the score.
When I think of “IO”, I think of clear counts as well, so someone with <50 timed dungeons at the end of the season, for example. Some people just aren’t interested in pushing keys, but if they have >50 timed keys even if they’re only 2K, they’re probably a solid pick.
Picking based on score alone is just as much a gamble as blind pugging.
And maybe that’s how he meant it and I misinterpreted. But I inferred he just meant score because his request is to have the highest score from any season displayed in game, so people picking groups can see his “gaming experience”.
100% agree, and yet for many, score is the extent of their vetting process when choosing who to invite. And then they get angry at their keys failing and want Blizzard to “fix it”.
With that logic, you could say the same thing about AOTC, raid achieves or PVP?
But these achieves are all we have to determine if a player is decent at the game. And IO is arguably one of the best indicators of skill, because at a certain IO rating it is almost impossible to carry someone, especially a healer.
You could go on to say a higher IO is a better indicator than raid logs, because logs simply show output, and don’t score on damage taken, or proper use of defensives without looking deeper, which m+ requires full knowledge of. The score on logs is simply based on your output compared to others, which is a great way to find pumpers but they might not always be perfect on other fundamentals.
I’ve had great success using IO to find players for all types of content using LFG. Even for pvp surprisingly, that might make you giggle but if someone has 2k IO and has PVP achieves I know they will 100% be a person to que with in games.
And I would really like to see player’s highest IO obtain, even if its from other expansions and have this show in game. Would really help improve the LFG community.
If someone has IO from BFA or legion and just came back, and also has the ILVL needed for the content, I would invite them to a raid, m+ or other content even if they have limited shadow lands experience. Having best IO show from prior expansions would be a great way to find more people to invite in LFG. Could give a lot of returning players extra help to get into groups.
Yes, and using those things as sole determinant factors in building any serious group is bad practice.
No, they’re not.
At the highest levels, sure. But at the levels most people are doing that’s just not true. When 4 people can carry a dead person through 15s, the score alone isn’t relevant anymore.
Nope.
Your fixation with trying to reduce everything to a single score is the problem. Logs absolutely show the things you’re talking about, you just have to look for them. IO can show some of the things you’re talking about but you have to look for it. There is not, and will likely never be a simple scoring system that will accurately measure a player’s ability.
I know you would, you’ve said it several times now.
It wouldn’t. It might help people who don’t know the new dungeons get into keys they’re not ready for, put together by group leaders who don’t know how to make a group.
And many of your groups would fail as a result.
Or returning players could just use their skill to quickly build the experience, and consequently the score, that will help them get into the groups they want the same way everyone else does.
Any indicator of someone’s game progress is better than no indicators at all.
Based on your replies I assume you are having trouble getting into groups. Maybe ask for advice and I can help you. I’ve been successfully using LFG solely for the last 2 expansions.
And I can 100% say at the current state of the game, without raider IO LFG wouldn’t be viable for PVE content.
Fortunately there are lots of indicators, with varying levels of time investment depending on how much information you want. This isn’t an issue of score or nothing. There are logs that provide the most info, a thorough look at M+/raid experience, which give a little less info, but is probably sufficient for most LFG content, a single io score, which is only slightly better than ilvl, which is only slightly better than having no criteria at all. I’m sure there are gradations between these, but I think that may cover the most significant evaluative techniques.
Why would you assume that? I’m not the one asking for expansions old scores to be displayed to help get into groups I’m not qualified for. I main a tank with KSM all expansion. I can get into basically any group I have an interest in joining.
Then why are you looking for your old scores to show up in game? Just keep doing what you’ve been doing. What am I missing?
That statement is debatable, but it is certainly a great tool. It’s especially strong when people use it intelligently and not just inviting the top 4 IO scores that show up applying. Adding IO scores from past expansions would make it a weaker tool, not stronger.
