I am writing this because I get the sense that Visions are a test run of what Torraghast will be, and I really like what I am playing thus far… except the ticket price. I do not understand this desire to force players to essentially do chores, to enjoy the legitimately fun content they have created.
I say this as someone who does not care about the cape gating or even the loot tier gating. I am absolutely fine with the way the loot drops, and the cape gating, I get it. I have no problem gating the mementos you can get per week, that is not my argument.
My problem is that to do this content, I need to do a combination of dailies and invasions to earn enough money to buy a ticket to do the really cool new stuff that I completely enjoy. And feeling like I have to slog thru stuff that I would do on my own time (some days I just want to do a few dailies after getting home from work, I don’t want the nail biting fun stress of visions) to get a ticket, really puts a sour taste in my mouth for everything.
And to counter-point, absolutely none of the other content has this requirement, and I don’t understand why they put it on this new stuff. For example, imagine the outrage if the M+ pushers only got 3-4 runs per week, regardless of outcome, and to get into a M+ you had to do 2-3 weekly quests and a number of dailies before you could walk in. Imagine that before you could queue for a random heroic, you had do the four emissary dailies, and a ticket would be in that chest, and if you wanted to run a second heroic, wait till tomorrow.
People would rightly lose their minds! Again, I am not saying change the loot rewards, I am not saying it is hard to get the currency, I am saying it is busy work and time gating and stops people from experiencing and enjoying the really amazing work they have done.
If they removed the cost of entry, they’d likely remove the scaling gear rewards. Or move the cloak upgrade to a different method. There are reasons to have limited attempts at this content.
In a few weeks when players have spare keys and can take the time to explore without feeling the sting of being left behind, this will be a non-issue. Why is everyone trying to keep pace with mythic raiders?
I am not even trying to compete with Mythic raiders, though. I just want to be able to do them as whenever I feel like it. Sometimes I just enjoy solo challenges. I have all my cloak upgrades available at the moment; that isn’t even remotely an issue with me. But because I solo’d the challenges and got my cloak upgrades, my buddy who is having issues (or my 2 friends who were like hey, wanna run with us?) are gonna have to go without me because I would have to grind out more stupid vessels in order to run with them. That is dumb. They don’t have to remove the scaling rewards as a result of removing the cost of entry. The rewards are gated to only being lootable once a week anyways (and the legendary cloak upgrades are also capped on a weekly basis). There’s no real reason to have vessels anyways other than to act as an annoying punishment should you fail (which thankfully isn’t something I have had to experience yet) and to prevent you from (I’m assuming) carrying other people through regularly? Either way, its nonsensical. If I want to burn myself out on visions in a month, let me. I’ll go play something else when I get bored anyways. All they’re doing now is making it so that I am like, oh I’ve done my M+ for the week and now I am out of vessels? Guess I’ll go play SWTOR until the resets.
I get that there will always be people who complain about a lack of content because they burn through it super fast, but even then, I am a staunch supporter of letting people play a game at their own pace. If you spend too much effort forcing people to play a game the way you want to, eventually you just drive away your players. If Torghast ends up requiring me to grind vessel like components in order to run it, then I my excitement towards shadowlands is already greatly diminished. When I first heard of Torghast I heard of a constantly changing see how far you can go challenge, and quite frankly that turned me on so much that i immediately bought shadowlands. If I only get to try 3 times a week, though, then what’s the point? Especially if that means if I do it solo and use my 3 tries… I then can’t do it with friends…
There’s a hard cap on how far you can get that slowly goes up each week.
Why does having excess attempts matter? It’s not like you can break the cap.
If anything removing the entry fee also means catching up on alts is easier and less time consuming if you decide to play an Alt and want to level the cloak up.
The gear is tied to how far you go with it, and how many side missons you take. Just removing the barrier to entry isn’t going to suddenly allow you to clear all the wings effortlessly.
Especially with the timer still constantly being in effect.
That’s the opposite of what he’s asking for. He specifically said he’s completely fine with the gear pacing and memento acquisition rate, but that he’d like to be able to just go in and play the content.
I know, it’s wild to see someone who says they want to do a thing in WoW just for the enjoyment of doing it. Especially in today’s “gimme the reward” mindset.
Systems like this reinforce the view that the overriding consideration by Blizz devs isn’t making fun and engaging content for players, rather it’s pleasing investors by implementing systems that drive their beloved “player engagement” and “/timeplayed” metrics ever higher.
It’s like they’ve taken their RNG on top of RNG with built in RNG model and ported it to create a new model of having a grind to engage in a grind with an additional imbedded grind.
Why can’t they just make fun, engaging, and rewarding content that players will do on their own initiative simply because the content if fun, engaging, and rewarding? Because if they were to do that, then that would also increase their “player engagement” and “/timeplayed” metrics, meaning that both their investors and players will be happy. But what do I know, I’m just a big, dumb cow.
I could care less about paying a cost to try. MT had a cost, and I loved that content and added a layer of difficulty knowing I had X amount of attempts before I had to break and farm nethershards.
My problem is that there is a relatively HARD cap on how many you can do and farm due to the high cost, and low reward outside of invasions. If they lowered cost of the vessel, it would be perfect.
I am happy it’s 2 per week. So I can do them and push them as far as possible. Then go out and do things I enjoy like mythic + and raiding. If it wasn’t limited it would be over done and people would get so sick if them and they would feel like islands do.
This seems more like stuff we more casual people would like, since you CAN do it solo and it seems kind of cool on the surface.
Up to rank 5, I actually enjoyed it. Now that I’m rank 5, going for six, it becomes too “arcadey” for me at 53. It is demoralizing to fail twice, in the same day, even working out strategies (based upon what I’ve read, going for the Dwarven District) bomb one.
Now I have 10 K visions again, probably trying at least once again this weekend. The latest stuff I’ve read suggests bringing many invis potions, trying that.
I think the mistake was Coalescing Visions and dailies rewarding like 50 of them. I think a vast improvement would be to make a set of dailies reward a vessel.
Yes, I know people are just going to say “I don’t like dailies so no!” but I think there should be a cost of entry for the Horrific Visions, it should just be more accessible.
After all, it seems like they were going for a D3 Greater Rift-like system and a Greater Rift Key is a joke to get.
Except upgrading ranks 6 - 15 don’t require ever going near Thrall or Alleria.
Thrall/Alleria are in the easiest areas of the Horrific Visions. Where’s the risk vs reward if you only consume the key doing the easiest common denominator?
If you can only get the quest once a week for the upgrade and only get gear from it on the first attempt you finish, how would doing it over and over change anything? Except that you could run with friends and guildies. I could run it 500 times this week and still only get 1 cloak upgrade.
Make it so you need to do the optional side AND kill thrall/Alleria.
Basically make it so killing them is the only “successful” way to clear it.
With the side areas buffing the bosses it’s clear this is part of the intention. Skipping by without going and getting the kills to upgrade the cloak is just easy.
I didn’t make the rules. I can’t answer that. All I’m saying is that if they didn’t restrict us entry, then they’d likely remove the reward structure or remove the upgrade path for the cloak. They have reasons for doing it this way – I don’t know what those are because I’m not on the dev team.
But it’s logical that the restriction is in place for either the reward path or the upgrade path, or possibly both. And removing the restriction would lead to removal of one of the reward paths, because that’s how Blizzard designs things.
Then why don’t you only get once shot at killing mythic bosses. they drop the best loot and you can beat you head against it as many times as needed to get the gear.
I don’t know. I’ve never understood why they have an infinitely scaling system and then give out rewards at only level 10, or now level 15. Dungeons should only give the best loot if you time them, tbh.
