Wow never had hardcore PvP servers. That’s not what a hardcore PvP server is. They were PvP servers.
He wants PvP servers back, because he thinks that ganking is what made wow great.
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So, War Mode bribes.
PvP servers had their chances. There were even RPPvP servers.
They crashed and burned, and from the ashes War Mode arose. I did not mourn when my PvP sever was no longer such because I got nothing out of PvP. My friends wanted to PvP, and I was out-voted so I joined the PvP server.
Then I get one-shot by a Rogue that wanted to make Sergeant rank that weekend, and decided ‘yeah this sucks.’ Again, War Mode.
People are having more fun in PvP because War Mode makes it so like-minded people can play together. Want to PvP? Click that little button and gank your heart out against other people also willing to accept that risk. Don’t want PvP? Click that little button and back to the safety of Orangeness you go.
War Mode is the full-on replacement for PvP servers because it works on a character-by-character basis, without trapping someone on a server they either have to transfer off of or delete their character and progress to play elsewhere.
AHASHAHHAHAHAHA you want FULL LOOT PvP?!
Get out of here you madman, those games die faster and harder than houseflies. Lemme tell you how it’ll go:
The First Day
People join the server, look around, explore, find their limits, and the ganking starts once one side (because remember this is a faction-based game so there’s ALWAYS teams) gets an advantage. Because this is full-loot, that advantage gets larger and larger with every successful gank because now not only does the ganking side have more material and gear to work with, but the other side can’t match the stats the ganking side had.
Day 10
The imbalance grows. Maybe one or two pockets of resistance show up, but it’s ultimately ineffective and the faction blobbing continues to worsen as people join up with the winning side just to play the rest of the game.
Day 30
Tumbleweeds.
Just no. Forced PvP is bad. Forced FULL LOOT PvP is game-suicide.
Then don’t be surprised when people leave this unfair world for one that at least allows them advancement. You and your ilk had your chances with PvP servers. They died. Now War Mode exists and it’s the perfect compromise.
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People who wanted PvP servers got their taste of it in Classic. A lot of them found the reality was way different from what they were expecting.
People who want hardcore PvP servers greatly overestimate how popular that genre is. Few people will join a server like that.
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I’m glad you understand. Warmode is right there waiting for you.
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Nobody is saying that demographic doesn’t exist, we’re just saying it’s tiny.
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We want PvP servers because for us, it’s about an immersive experience with a closed tight-knit community. Ganking is only a part of what happens naturally, but it’s so much more than that; making friends, making enemies, the stories, the things which happen when you’re playing a game that resides in a world and not a ‘match’
Warmode doesn’t offer us that, when it’s about really taking our venture seriously and digging down a little bit more about what it means to have consistency with a core group of people all along the way, however big or small.
Nobody is being trapped into anything when they are told what it’s about BEFOREHAND, just like nobody is trapped in an ‘ironmode’ challenge’ when they opt to embark on it.
Then they are without excuse. Since they knew the risks & rewards going into it and chose to do it.
How’s it forced PvP, if no one is forcing you to do it? You 100% have the option to stay on your server. You literally don’t have to get involved at all.
If PvP isn’t your thing–no shame. PvE servers WITH the OPTION to enable warmode remain right as rain.
For US, we want our own corner of the vineyard.
Even a good artist observes from nature, and in nature you don’t find that things are perfectly balanced 100% of the time.
What’s more interesting to you?
A flat piece of land.
Or a land, with rugged terrain; with mountains and waterfalls, soaring cliffs and LOW valleys which descend into utter darkness.
I’d say they BOTH have their merits.
By whose metric did they crash and burn?
If they crashed and burn, why did I have such a great time here on Lightninghoof (RPPvP) from 2007 right up and on thru when WM was implemented.
The idea that realms need to be explicitly 50 / 50 or meet some arbitrary norm is not of a sound truth. Not everyone sees it this way, and had I HAD the opportunity to be in TEN nothing in favor of the horde, think of all the amazing possibilities that exist for me as the ‘underdog’. That’s fun–a LOT more interesting than a predictable plain old boring flat level playing field.
Lol, i’ve gotta laugh because, I can see how one would think that
But I can’t count, how many times where I’ve been in the zone COMPLETELY out numbered and literally, the only one there
and guess wat
THE HORDE IGNORED ME!
I HAD TO ANNOY THEM!
I HAD TO ENGAGE THEM!
as if to say, “NOTICE ME HERE I AM”
They were the good ones being busy, doing their WQs & chores, and I was out to cause trouble–
I’m THAT guy…
Who DIVE BOMBS From his flying mount into your round circle little ‘group therapy session’ thingy
THEN, I FLY AWAY AS YOU ALL CHASE ME. I DISMOUNT YOU GUYS ONE BY ONE
And it’s easy pickings from there.
Just because it’s a pvp server doesnt mean that everyone everywhere is going to be ganking always.
Nay, the world will balance itself out if you just let it.
Let the cards fall where they may fall
Ye, sometimes you’ll have your deviants. But that’s all part of world building and people earning reputations within a community.
See, that’s a lot more like instanced PvP by nature.
Leveling and the whole JOURNEY IS the GAME, and a majority of the fun, especially if it can also be no transfer and no boost.
Again, we just want normal, regular servers like you guys got. Just like the way you guys play the game, except they are pvp locked. People are still doing pve, raids, dungeons, mount farming, pet battles, RP, etc. etc. etc. etc.
it’s the ADDED dynamic of WPvP that makes the magic happen
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If it was a server only for max level characters that would be interesting, but the people shouting the most for PVP servers would never play it. As they’ve demonstrated in this thread, their only reason for asking for this in the first place was so they could go back to ganking lowbies.
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Seems like he’s trying to make it pretty clear what people will be signing up for. Not much of a trap.
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…It’s working out better than the alternative. This forum is going to give me a heart condition.
Only way I can see that working without the same problems it caused before is to make these “real deal” pvp servers not have a single thing to do with pve. No dungeons, no raids. Just pure pvp. That way only those who actually want to pvp will join, no people who just want to play with their pvp friends, all while hating themselves for doing something that they don’t enjoy.
Or if those activities are included, they need to be open world or have two opposite teams able to enter the same instance. Teams will need to strategize when to work together to bring boss health down sufficiently and when to go all out pvp without fully wiping themselves - all while trying to do the same thing to the other team.
Not my cup of tea, but I could see that being fun for some.
Why didn’t you just ask your guild to become your personal army. Smh sounds like you deserved it for not socializing enough which is what classic is all about.
Open your Talents panel and turn on War Mode. TADDA! You are now in a “hardcore” PvP server.
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You mean please bring back high-lvls camping low-lvl leveling zones to make them feel big about themselves bullying low-lvl players? Nothing about “1337 pvper versus care bear” at all in that situation, just hopeless empty souls trying to feel like they get the upper hand virtually. /golfclap
Because people disagree with you?
I wish they could disagree with me. But that assumes they understand the conversation. And the amount of times I say
“Gear is anti-PVP because if gear wins, it’s not pvp, it’s pvg”
and they go
“Ok but like, what else are we going to do? Just give people free gear?”
The answers I get on these forums read like you answered your wife while you were watching Fast & Furious.
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Ah yes, I remember the fond camaraderie I developed with, um… checks notes … Random rogue player #12 that stunlocked me to death. Oh the ~wonders~ we shared!
Again, it sounds like what you want is War Mode. Since you’re asking for the exact same boons and interactions associated with it.
You’re right. The most common response to someone complaining they got got in War Mode is ‘PvP Happened, turn off War Mode.’
This is a game best played with a community by your side, ideally with friends. If your friends want to PvP 4-1, I either play alone or I play on the PvP server and serve as the gankbait and honor farm. Alternatively, I guess I don’t play, but that’s also kind of a bummer too.
With THIS setup, the friends that want to PvP can PvP their brains out, and I don’t lose my progress on my server just because I didn’t want to be someone’s stepping stone to Captain!
Again, War Mode exists exactly for you. Once you activate it, it carries all of the risks of being ganked and being vulnerable to enemy attack. You can activate it from the very beginning so you can carry the ‘danger’ of being ganked through the whole leveling experience. It carries all of the ‘epicness’ of possibly being drawn into a full-out conflict. It just doesn’t obligate ME to do the same.
When Tarren Mill because un-bloody-playable because Horde and Alliance were having ANOTHER spat over it? That was my cue to log off for the night and do something else. What a game.
You speak as someone with zero idea of what a balanced composition actually looks like.
Of course more dynamic landscapes will be more interesting, but that’s because there’s more going on. You still have balance in your compositions however, those peaks and jagged lines mean nothing without the scale and placement to ensure they’re the focus, and everything in a well-done photo or picture serves the elements within it.
Static, basic squares can be utterly imbalanced composition-wise, but they’d also be boring to look at without some kind of dynamism to the piece, such as other smaller squares to balance the larger.
If they didn’t depopulate to the point of getting meme’d on, Blizzard wouldn’t have felt the need to pull the plug on them and consolidate servers, nor would they have felt the need to implement War Mode to make WPvP more palatable for everyone involved.
Okay, and? You can still do that in War Mode. You can still do that in instanced PvP. You can still do that in any setting you so choose to interact in. All forcing PvP is doing is obligating ME to do the same.
Citation extremely needed here.
That said, no, the worlds do not ‘self-balance’ nor do they ‘self-regulate’. You wanna know how a PvP server goes? I told you how it would roll up a few posts ago, here lemme get the quote:
You still haven’t refuted this, by the way, because there is no refuting it. This isn’t a battle royale, it’s not last-one-standing, it’s team-based and people, just to play the game, will eventually want to join the winning team that isn’t constantly assaulting and camping them.
Oh, word? No-transfer and no-boost? And you’re still claiming you’re not trying to trap people on that server?
If you want the ‘thrill’ of being gank-bait from 1-59, just turn on War Mode as soon as you get to the capital. Bing, the PvP Server Experience! You can gank and be ganked the whole live-long day!
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Keep in mind that while faction balance is in evitable in a PvP game or system, and had deteriorated to unplayability already by the time of Legion on many servers, it was the type of Legion world content that had levelers and max level players doing the same quests at the same time that were its death knell on PvP servers that weren’t already single faction. Unlike in previous expansions, players had to go out into the world regularly in order to keep up with their progression.
An attempt was made to “balance” PvP servers with CRZ, which turned out to be a disaster, as lots of (Alliance) players suddenly found the game unplayable.
When I stopped playing my horde characters on Tich at the end of wod, the server had seemed balanced. When I started leveling them mid-Legion, the only Alliance I saw were getting gang ganked at flight points.
Combine this with level scaling, which meant a broad range of levelers of both factions were leveling together, no doubt it became clear that things would only get worse left on their own.
And so we got warmode, still way too optional for those players who want their intended victims to be stuck being their victims for the rest of their wow days. This “It’s your own fault you chose to roll on a server to play with your friends when you were 12 years old, and now they haven’t played for years and you’re stuck on a server that is dead to your faction. You knew this was going to happen, log in so I can kill you!” Like. Nah.
OP literally asked for PvE/warmode servers to remain. You could still play with your friends on one just like today.
And if they want to explore this ‘hardcore space’? I have to create a character on a soon-to-be-dead server and hope I guess right as to which faction will eventually win, or I’ve wasted my time.
Again, everything he wants, War Mode provides.
Talk to your friends about it? Everyone’s experience should hand on your 4 friends? Man the egos…