Then play with divine storm, and let the people who want to twist… have their twisting. I don’t care if you don’t find it fun, just let us have our twist, we don’t want to take your DS. Divine storm already shares a chest rune slot with Seal of martyrdom, so you cant do both already.
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Well I don’t really care if you find seal twisting fun I don’t want to have to do snap shouting play style.
Just because you want to add it bak in I would much rather be an actual rotation And I still say it’s bad it’s not fun.
At the end of the day blizzard has to listen Somebody’s opinion on it And i’m going to keep saying seal twisting isn’t fun it’s snapshotting in borderline exploitive.
And like i’ve set If they want to add it on another rune Maybe belt or boots That’s fine Heck I’ll even say that maybe your seals last 30 Minutes And the damage is increased by 10%.
And the other one can have your seal twisting As long as I don’t have to take it I don’t care.
you would have your options, let seal twisting exist, and let people like you do what paladins are doing now.
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I would love to see seal twisting with SOC and SOM in the game, I love the option for the playstyle and I think it is a fair trade off if you don’t like it to have DS. Would love to see it in the game, please blizz.
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So you don’t like interactive rotations
Ummm no cata mop df all are Interactive rotations I just don’t likes snap Shouting just liek Heroic strike queuing or The double chain lightning stuff or hek Even the whole blessing spam thing with protection paladins.
Give me an actual rotation Seal twisting is not that.
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Seal twisting just adds a timing element to the rotation, like playing a Slam warrior. It’s an incredibly quality design that isn’t common.
Your ignorant screeching is embarrassing.
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No thanks.
Ret is already busted. You don’t need anything more
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The only reason people like seal twisting in TBC is because it gave 100-200 DPS to parse over people who weren’t using it. If it was the same amount of DPS as a non twisting alternative none of you would care about it even a little.
It’s not good for the game.
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In what way?
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he literally just explained it lol
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Because it’s a DPS boost granted for having obscure knowledge of the game and running weakauras/add-ons to make sure you can do it reliably, in most cases. This was never intended gameplay, so adding it is ridiculous.
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He did not.
With the TBC alteration it’s a perfectly intuitive system. A swing timer is not some indecipherable black box, and the resulting gameplay is incredibly unique and satisfying.
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Do you not understand that it’s just a free DPS boost for those who are in the know? It’s elitist nonsense. The satisfying part is that you’re doing more damage because you know how to do it while others don’t. Nothing is intuitive about it, you didn’t learn this by playing, some video guide told you. I would be okay with seal twisting if it was already there from the beginning, but asking them to add it in is ridiculous. And you can already twist somewhat, you guys just want more.
If they add the martyr twisting and it gives you no extra damage over an alternative where you just press 1 extra button for the same amount of damage, would you still want it for the gameplay?
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Design that’s kind of hilarious considering seal twisting as a completely player found accident.
It wasn’t intended You look at numerous interviews with blizzard Especially with some of the older debts they will admit. They never really got the paladin,feel right.
I play ret Send Original tbc in 2007 The first time I even heard the name or the phrase seal twisting was 2019 Classic so no it was not some the intended or designed.
And good design its snap Shotting It’s the same thing as heroic strike. Chewing the same thing as the double chain lightning thing that shahmans do.
And the same thing With the dk Gargoyle All of those things are Snap Shouting Every single one of them.
I don’t try to make it sound like oh, this is the holy grail of design when it was completely unintended and discovered by accident.
Cata mop and wrath We’re way more fun than Oh look at me i’ve to put up two seals and time it It’s annoying in an unfun part of gameplay I didn’t play ret in tbc Because of it hek wod Legion and df Were way better designed of ret.
Then Classic or tbc
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This is not correct.
With the TBC change anyone should be able to figure out this type of interaction. It’s only marginally more involved than figuring out how Slam works and ending up with a similar playstyle.
The issue with this is that you are still parsing against people with that simplified rotation. I didn’t play this warrior in TBC because Slam did S tier damage relative to other classes. I played it because the playstyle was great fun. However, I still am a competitive player and enjoy competing, and one of the magical things about parsing is that it’s intraspec and therefore you can enjoy competing even with a bum spec. Having the easy version of the same spec do more damage would break this gameplay loop.
It’s a far more sensible solution to have the more challenging rotation yield more damage when played well. Not because more damage is the point per se, but because it just makes sense. Greater difficulty should yield greater rewards, and with the parsing meta-game that philosophy links up perfectly with the type of person most concerned with their performance.
Emergent gameplay can lead to good “design”. The terminology doesn’t require that it be intentional. Shatter combos were also emergent gameplay.
Seal twisting is nothing like the kind of snapshotting you’re talking about. It adds a tempo element to the rotation in addition to the priority system that every spec otherwise follows. It’s an incredible additional layer that feels amazing to use. I wish swing timers were baked into the regular UI, but it’s a minor inconvenience to unlock something so enjoyable.
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You ignored my question which was at the heart of the matter. Would you play it, if it was added, and gave no extra DPS? And the answer is, of course, no. Unless they teach every player how to do it, it’s stupid for them to add it to the game, because it would not be accessible to everyone.
You don’t seem to understand that it’s not emergent gameplay if they just add it to the game.
You’re asking for them to add something to the game that was not intended but players found. Having them add that back in will put players into two camps, ones who know how to twist and get extra DPS from doing it, and ones who don’t. But I’m all for it if there’s no DPS advantage.
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It’s still snapshotting no it does not bring another layer it’s annoying The simple fact is the fact that you have to use a swing timer to begin with It’s not a fun game play mechanic.
And no matter how you slice it it still snapped shooting This isn’t some deep layer You are timing one spell impressing one spelled right after the other.
Snap shotting You are stacking 2 buffs and attacking That is what it is it’s not this deep thing It’s the same type of concepts as fury prot I would rather see them do something to make the rotation more fluent.
It’s the same thing as power shifting And bear waiting Is committedly not the same type of exact This thing with those two but the concept is still the same.
It’s not a fun game play at least not to me. Why you enjoy it who knows It’s not fun it’s not deep And you don’t like I said if they want to bake it into a rune Fine.
But I don’t want it on the back end Because then that makes it required to use And I Don’t one reforce into a games playstyle that I despise.
And before you say well, why don’t you go another class? Believe it or not I enjoy palatin I love the class I just don’t like seal twisting.
Just like when I Warrior I hated heroic strike quing Plain and simple.
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I would literally roll a paladin (which I currently have no plans to do) if they added seal twisting, even it did the same damage as the alternative. I didn’t get to play this warrior nearly as much as I wanted to in TBC, and Slam in Vanilla both isn’t the same and I don’t feel is going to get much support. Were it to be added it absolutely should do more damage, however.
I already answered this question by the way, but I guess you need things spelled out for you.
It was emergent gameplay. In TBCC it became codified, like Shatter combos did.
Which is great. There being depth to a spec which you can master and elevate yourself through is quality design. The kind of jank that ferals get into is bad, but twisting with the TBCC change leads to perfectly elegant gameplay.
Everyone has access to addons. The ship sailed nearly two decades ago on the pearl clutching over their ubiquity and, sometimes, necessity.
Calling it snapshotting is inaccurate in a practical sense. You’re technically correct, but you’re actually wrong. No one who isn’t trying to malign twisting would refer to it as snapshotting, because it isn’t anything like every other instance of snapshotting that people talk about when they use the term.
Yes, and maintaining that alongside the rest of your rotation and in the context of different fights adds a layer to your combat that is incredibly satisfying to execute on. It adds an almost infinite ability to improve and perfect your execution of every fight.
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Blizzard should not purposefully add in runes that require add-ons. That makes no sense. No one is pearl clutching here, TBC-nostalgia obsessed Paladins are just being unreasonable asking for this because it’s literally for a minority of players who know how to do it. It’s a small minority asking for this loudly being spearheaded by Twitch streamer Esfand. Why should they add something when most people do not twist seals?
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