Phase 2 PvP was and continues to be a huge mistake

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
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First off I want to say that this is coming from someone who got standing 1 (horde) last week on Incendius which I’ve heard is around 55-45 horde favored and high pop (feels more like 70/30 horde favored based on what I’m seeing out in the world).

I love PvP in Vanilla and TBC and I’ve played it for years, when Blizz announced the phases I knew phase 1 would still be fun because fresh servers are always fun even if it is only MC without a PvP system, but I knew phase 2 was going to be a huge mistake and cause a lot of players to quit before the game gets good (phase 3 and even more so 4) because they think Vanilla just sucks, which isn’t the case and wouldn’t have ever been the case if Blizzard would just consult with actual Vanilla players (anyone who actually plays the game could have told them exactly how this would play out).

On my server the Alliance are quivering in fear and rightfully so, they are corpse camped on the way to every dungeon and every common quest zone. The ones who are trying to rank have resorted to grouping as 5+ and run as fast as they can if you show any interest in fighting them, even if they have the numbers advantage. As someone who is trying to farm honor it isn’t fun running around hunting and camping bodies of casual players just trying to enjoy the game, but I have to because all the Alliance pvpers are so scared of getting zerged by honor starved horde that they just run from every fight.

This system of pvp was meant for player caps of 2500 not 10k or w/e it is. I knew it would be bad but this is even worse than I thought. What I’m doing to get honor isn’t fun and feels borderline unethical, I’ve tried roaming the world looking for 1v1s or even 1v2s but I’m always forced to resort to camping searing gorge or some other spot to keep up on honor. The only reason I do it is because I know how much I enjoy BGs and I want to get the ranks for when that comes out. I guarantee the Alliance I’m fighting are not having fun, and I’m not as someone who loves pvp and is standing 1, so who is? My guess is less than 10% of players

When I tried roaming around solo people see me on their Spy addon (why is this still allowed to exist is insane to me) they would try to log out, they would try to run, a lot of the time they were so demoralized they would just stand there and /cry

Vanilla is always great at the start of a server, and around ZG patch on, the in between is not great even when BGs are in, but without BGs this is horrible.

Please Blizzard consider adding BGs immediately (and I’m begging that you don’t do 1.12 AV, please don’t make rankers rush the last boss in AV without doing any objectives every game) and launching phase 3 sooner than later to give players other options of content than just griefing people in the open world for ranks.

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I am by not means saying you’re wrong, but I want to point out something that you may have not considered.

Alliance are playing roughly how they typically do on the typical server. They’re often from my experience a bit cowardly.

This is something I did not realize was the situation until the CRBG’s came out and showed me just how crap the typical player actually is… The alliance lead the pack when it comes to complaining about PVP, be this in the world or in the BG’s.

I have learned that if you peel an alliance healer he will simply run away and you get stuck with the horde that were on him. As a result you may as well just look out for your self (selfishly) and let him die.

So as you can see the culture of the typical alliance player is crap. This is the truth and while it sucks for the typical alliance player, this is just the way it is.

Horde is also crap, but in different ways… The average and typical horde player will zerg with the pack and contribute with the pack but if it’s a 1v1 he runs back to the pack… This is the one thing alliance actually tend to do better, at least the DPS…

Unfortunately for the alliance the typical horde PVP player is more skilled, because most of the PVP community went horde (for alleged better PVP racials).

As a result of this the Alliance are indeed outnumbered on PVP servers roughly by 2.5:1 on average some servers are better, some are worse. The Horde are not off the hook here tho, because while they enjoy the PVP world dominance on most servers their PVP Q’s are going to be long, really really long.

IMO This is the fault of Blizzard not managing and limiting character creation on PVP servers based on faction population. This is something THEY had immediate data on when the servers opened for character creation pre-launch.

Even post launch they could have managed this by limiting by faction character creation and posting data on the server page such as This server’s Horde population is maxed out, either pick alliance or select a different server. Doing something simple like that would have helped a lot.

You’re also correct that a lot of people have likely quit because of the faction imbalance and the fact that on some servers you simply cannot play certain classes due to getting swarmed by 5 to 10 enemy players… No amount of skill can save you from that.

So what can blizzard do?

  1. Open faction specific transfers PVP realm to PVE realm (horde)
  2. Add faction specific Q’s for the over populated faction on any given server so that the over budgeted faction takes second seat to the under populated faction.

This will force the over populated faction to either Transfer or Re-roll the opposite faction.

Doing so saves the quality of game play for both factions, because unless you’re bad (talking in general) there is no reward to killing a single player when you’re with 5+ players in a group.

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Shouldn’t come as a surprise but I am on board with you Nanettie. Feel the same way. I hope they don’t continue to make these mistakes. Fingers crossed that they start listening to players in the community that have their fingers on the pulse of what’s going on.

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This is pretty well written and it’s nice to see a different perspective on this situation as well(a horde player on a dominant server not having as much fun ranking) hopefully something is done, but I doubt it. Some people rerolled to a pve server. Some will be back when bgs drop. Others have straight up quit and You can’t blame them

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As an alliance on Herod I appreciate this so much lol. Thanks for the post mate

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Standing 10 on Kirtonos (35A 65H)

Agreed. It’s just funny how many horde faction players cant admit this iteration of the patching is super boring and unfun. Yeah, you’ll get one fun 5v5 or 10v10 per night, the rest is literally combing zones for kills. If you’re the majority, you can try and tell yourself it’s fun, but it’s not.

Alliance on my server are very skittish too, and I agree they need to sack up, but still, it’s impossible to win a numbers game when it’s so heavily in one side’s favor.

It’s not even close to how classic WPvP was. BG’s should come ASAP.

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Well said and it’s nice to see a different point of view from a horde. I’ve abandoned questing or even farming in a rare location. I spent 45 minutes the other night trying to get into BRD. A raid of horde 60s corpse camped me the entire way. I’d die. They’d move along with me. I was 55. At some point I’m pretty sure I wasn’t worth honor to them, but they stayed with me since it was obvious I was going to brd.

I even stayed dead and ate dinner with my girlfriend. I came back and they were on their mounts just jumping around pointlessly. This was full of grieving. I figured logging or quitting for the night would give them the satisfaction they wanted so I refused to give up. Made it to brd, cleared emp with group and I’ll never go back to brm unless for MC.

I thought questing in stv was a slaughter. Phase 2 has legit made me want to quit and spend more time on my guitar

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I don’t think Alliance are cowardly Horde just cant understand what it is like fighting two or three times your number within a minute of each other.
You seem to think Alliance run away from every fight but by god sometimes i haven’t even finished eating before the next Grand Marshall wannabe runs up looking for a fight.
It’s a Zerg fest for Horde and Alliance are getting sick of it. Most can’t be bothered fighting five times their numbers day after day and quite frankly have hit their honor cap for the week after the first 3 days.

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The state of the games on pvp servers are far worse then anytime I played in vanilla. Glad im done leveling but phase 2 caused almost all my non 60 friends to quit because everything Is a big gank fest. BGs should be out next week because the state of this game is unplayable for most people. (Especially with faction imbalance).

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just tried to do a little questing and got camped. I am wishing I rolled PVE now. This may be what causes me to quit. I would take one of those transfers to another server if it was PVE.

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You’ll be surprised how much fear you can put into Horde after wiping their raids with a few mages supported by raids doing 4k burst without sappers. After a few of those, the next raid wipes become so much easier since they reflexively run away lol.

It wasn’t like Vanilla, you are right. It’s more like RvR fighting at the moment.

Horde will be cowardly when you sync mage aoe burst in chokeholds and put fear in their hearts.

Even most people ranking up and getting kills most of the day are kinda sick of it.

No such thing as an honor cap. There’s a soft honor cap after 168 hours of play in the week. (Or if you killed every horde player at least 4 times)

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Oh no I completely agree, but I’m saying you guys are so used to being zerged that it has become normal to just assume there are raids of horde behind everyone, so even when alliance have the numbers they end up running. I spend 90% of my time looking for someone, 9% chasing people, 1% fighting. The only way for me to get consistent honor is by doing some messed up searing gorge camping or ganking people who I can tell don’t really want to be pvping

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Yeah there is if you aren’t in bracket three.

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This is mostly what makes people a bit sick of phase 2. But there’s some nice RvR sometimes.

Yeah, this is the easiest way I’ve seen to wipe 20-40 man horde raids with 6-20 people. If they get spooked and see like 5 people in front instantly die, they’ll run and be CC’ing themselves with that maneuver.

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I feel your pain some of the Horde are just thirsty and it is shameful watching what they will do to get Honor. I don’t even bother ganking lowbies anymore they can just farm next to me since i know if i want to hit my honor targets for the week i can just go pvp with a group of three in EPL and get constant fights for the next 4 hours.

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Phase 2 isn’t terrible for me because I have stealth. But I’m really sad to see so many people on my server quit because the game has become unplayable… especially for levelers. When pvp was introduced in vanilla people rarely formed raids to pvp and camp the other faction (Everyone was relatively new).

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yeah, i swear it was a lot more casual than this. Kinda like how it was phase 1. I loved playing PVP before the purge.

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spy definitely facilitates some fowl gameplay. the people who are out will be found as opposed to finding a nice quiet spot to grind mobs/quests.

horde so hungry they will travel an entire zone for 1.

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you picked the popular faction with racials and a class geared towards offensive pvp

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Yeah I remember when I first started playing in the original WoW I started a few months late and I was able to hide behind trees and watch hunting groups pass, it was exciting. Allowing addons that give a gameplay advantage in Vanilla shouldn’t be a thing imo, even something like a castbar addon should either be banned or just added to the default UI. I get the feeling that Activision Blizzard either doesn’t care about Vanilla and just wanted to try to bait people back onto their platform hoping they’d try other games and end up in the cash shop, or they are just completely out of touch.