I primarily experience this from the perspective of Blacksmithing (I have both an Armorsmith and a Weaponsmith) and Engineering.
While efforts have been made to reign in the issues surrounding patron work orders, the reality is that they are still in such a bad spot that I don’t want to interact with the system any longer.
Blacksmithing:
- Regularly given patron work orders where the material costs exceeds 10-15k despite the recent changes. This is true for most blacksmithing orders.
- Given multiple work orders in a week that I have absolutely no chance of doing. My Weaponsmith receiving multiple requests for armor that I’m not specialized into, or my Armorsmith getting multiple weapon requests.
While it can be agreed that Blacksmithing probably should be a little more costly than other professions - there’s a reason we can charge a premium for our services, it does not change the fact that the investment for the return is not worth it with the patron orders most of the time.
It’s fine if I say, get a crafting order for an alloy to be rank 2 when I’m not specialized into it. I can use a little bit of concentration, or some higher quality materials. I at the very least KNOW the recipe. But to receive a patron order that is both expensive and a recipe I don’t know. It’s just rude.
Engineering:
- While not nearly as bad as Blacksmithing in terms of cost, regularly the only items provided by the patrons are Pile of Rusted Scrap. Now if you’re not an engineer you’ll probably not know that we have thousands of this material at this point. The only worthwhile use of it is to scrap it and hope you get other materials to use/sell. Having it instead be actually able to be used in our patron orders would give it an actual value outside of this. Also if an order requires 64 bolts, can the patron please provide them?
- Similarly to Blacksmithing - more often than not I get orders I can not do due to not being specialized in the right tree and not knowing the pattern. This is mostly present in any of the engineered equipment. I have 1 of my characters specialized into just making parts, tinkers, and bombs. Well, guess what? I regularly get bracers, guns, and profession tools that I can not possibly do. It’s fine for my characters specialized into those trees, because they have those recipes ON TOP of already having the bombs & tinkers, etc. But because I’m not specialized in the tree, I can’t even learn the patterns for the orders I get most of the time.
We shouldn’t be punished for specializing how we want to. If progression in this system is tied directly to how many patron orders I can complete, then I’m simply behind other players who happened to get more favorable patron orders.
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What? No why are doing this? You can use it to get tinkers from DF scaled up to TWW.
Only two of them are actually available of the four in the game though. The usefulness is also a bit dubious aside from the invisibility tinker being nice to save on invis pots if doing any skips in keys (which there are so few of this season).
I am not seeing the problem nearly as much on my engineering, personally, but blacksmithing is absolutely extremely problematic. The delta of average patron order cost between my blacksmith and every other profession is ridiculously large, and the frequency I see patron orders for blacksmithing that have provided zero of the expensive materials is far and away the highest of any of them (and that’s aside from the fact we’re still getting too many orders we can’t actually reach yet, all because we unlocked the precursor node to those recipes).
Blacksmithing definitely needs to be looked at again.
I agree. It is pretty regular to see patron orders asking that you supply either 10 sanctified alloy, or 10 charged alloy, or BOTH. This brings the cost of the craft up to 10k-20k (for you) for one knowledge point. I never fill these orders. Complete waste of time.
Millhouse Manastorm is the worst when it comes Profession Orders as the stingy sod won’t provide anything!
How to fix the crafting order system.
Make it so every item right now that is Soul bound, is not soul bound.
Crafters should be able to make any item they have the materials for and put it on the AH. None of this “Has to be done from a crafting order.”
Crafting orders should be a passive thing that buyers can list up and crafters can pull down.
When it comes to items that require a spark. Make it so you can craft any piece of gear you want with out a spark, but its inert. So for example i can craft a heroic level weapon, but its not activated, it can do anything.
Then a player has to activate it with a spark, which makes it soul bound.
Inactive items can be sold on the AH.
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I don’t know, this expansion almost never see crafting orders from the public and when I do, they are for less gold than the patrons offer majority of the time. The ones the Patron’s offer usually never has the expensive component, rare component and you rarely see the catch-up mechanic offering the knowledge point I need and all my professions that continue to fall further behind have been crafting since day one.
Guarantee if your behind on your professions if they sold books that caught you up for gold people would do it and that would take money out of the game. Last expansion I had 21,000 on average of this expansions Aritsan’s Acuity and already on some characters I have 1500+ with nothing to spend it on.
The patron orders are NOT to make gold! They are for skill ups initially and later they are for knowledge points and AA. You are pretty much paying for your points instead of doing quests and picking dirt piles. They also enable a good numbers of first crafts. Do not expect to make any kind of profit out of them.
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I’m not even getting the knowledge point being offered to me 90% of the time. So, I am falling further and further behind on some of my professions. I don’t make gold anyways from crafting as I mostly craft for free if I can R3 or R5 a craft I will do it or otherwise I won’t even try if it means a skill-up because I value the customer wanting the best over me wanting another sub-point.
When it comes to customers verse patrons, the patrons seem to be paying better than the few work orders I do see from real customers. I can only craft 4 public orders initially, then 1 a day afterward. I refuse to sit in trade channel in a city twiddling my thumbs when I could be enjoying the game and helping more people out while I adventure. Would be nice if the crafters had a global channel they could watch and not sit in the city.
A few of my professions have no more first crafts and are behind on sub-tree knowledge points (Alchemy is a good example, whereas Enchanter I always hit my weekly). The Artisan’s Acuity I almost don’t even need any more on many of my professions because that is what gets offered to me the most from the patrons.
I have zero use for more gold. Passively while adventuring I have 11 million since I came back at launch of Shadowlands, 750k of that I keep in my mailbox bouncing around because I can’t trust the game anymore not to lose it like all those in the Great Bank Heist of 2024.
So you CAN afford some of the more costy no mats patron orders, you abase yourself for your customers and you are into some less than in demands wheels on your professions specs. And the patrons order its there fault… How?
I’m not going to drop 10k gold on a patron order that’s going to give me 10-30 Artisan’s Acuity, a +5, +10, +20 or +40 skill book or a 1-hour stat buff. I farm everything I use to craft for customers or patrons. My main issue with the patrons is a catch-up for knowledge point books and I rarely see those books.
This is why I almost have zero need for the Artisan’s Acuity now on multiple professions. Last expansion and I still have in my reagent bank 21,308 Artisan’s Mettle on just my Alchemist alone, my other 6 crafters have between 19-21000.
I don’t care how much gold a patron pays me; I just find it funny that the patrons pay more than customers in the public orders. The patrons are acting just like last expansions customers that would give no mats and low gold that they could resell on the auction house. Thats why I am ok with the patrons, at least I know the item is being taken out of the game.
But I shouldn’t be +33 behind on knowledge points on some crafts because the RNG said here’s more Artisans Acuity or a +5, +10, +20, +40 skill book. I do find it interesting I could be at 396 with all 3 tier mats and it requires 380 concentrations to get to 400 skill, but if I use weaker materials the difference in concentration doesn’t adjust much higher.
What I am noticing on my crafters is ‘how far behind’ seems to be based on when they learned the Khaz Algar Profession and how many Glimmers they’ve let rot, which then directly correlates to how many Flickers they are offered on a daily basis. But since Flickers are the attempt to catch them up, the closer they get to whatever that benchmark is the fewer Flickers they are offered on a daily basis.
My main Tailor is by my count nine points behind where she could be. She sees 3-4 Flickers offered per week.
My main Blacksmith is about 25 points behind where she could be and is offered 2-3 Flickers per day.
My main Engineer is about 50 points behind where she could be and is offered 4-6 Flickers per day.
And since Flickers are the means to catch-up, any Flickers that rot are not added to how far behind that crafter may be.
If you are not being offered Flickers on a daily basis then you are much closer to where Blizzard’s system thinks you should be than you think you are.
I use Myu’s Knowledge Points Tracker. It’s part of a Weak Aura that tells you all the sources of KP and where to find them weekly. Even on new characters that might need the onetime special treasures or vendors.
I have 7 crafters, with my Enchanter / Tailor being on the same character. My leatherworker is my only skinner and other 5 crafters have a corresponding gatherer to that main profession and don’t need catch-up. My other 29 characters are dual gathers of herbs and mines and funnel their mats to my crafters once they hit 80.
- Alchemy - +5
- Blacksmith - +31
- Enchanter - 0
- Engineer - +7
- Inscription - +21
- Jewel crafter - +14
- Leatherworker - +21
- Tailor - +26
I been crafting and gathering since pre-launch and to help my leatherworker out I buy the Odd-Glob of Wax Leatherworking satchel a lot. In the above list, anything in the + is how many KP that tracker says I am behind and when you do get a “flicker”, the game will remove 1-2 points but not 1st time knowledge points as those don’t change how many you still need.
Those are pretty bad, enchanting is so much worse, heres 3 recipes you have to specialize in the nonsense stuff like masks and illusions, still cant farm dust.
I used the Odd-Glob of Wax at first to buy a couple of Enchanter satchels until I started to find more Bind on Equip and Warband bound green items to keep sending to my enchanter. Now I have two bags of blue, green and purple items waiting to be disenchanted each week for the knowledge points.
It’s the price we pay to level our enchanting and to have the materials by sacrificing gear we might be able to use on alternate characters.
I just skip the expensive patron orders. Doesn’t really bother me.
And on the flip side, when you get patron orders where the expensive mats are provided, then there’s a good chance your resourcefulness will pay off nicely.
I like the current system. I also think it’s good that some people can go gonzo spendy in order to get a few extra points - more power to them.
edit: if anything, I think it’s really healthy for an economic sub-game to have the player constantly assessing whether a particular decision is ‘worth it.’
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