You must have known it was coming tho.
Wasn’t going to happen. Changes were coming, if only to being Oracle up, but Disc was too easy to do well at higher key levels. Like brain dead easy which is why changes were coming
Smite. We dont know yet if WV will be the go come season 2
This
Here’s to hoping that the changes to Holy give them enough AoE healing finally. I still feel like a Lightweaver/PoH build might not be enough for a fight like second boss of Dawnbreaker though. And even with these changes I still feel like HW: Sanctify probably won’t move anyone’s health bars.
Don’t Forget, they nerfed Apoth from 300% to 200%.
The reason is Holy Priests in keys can run Oracle and taking Guardian Angel makes it line up with Piety for the only burst healing the spec has currently. Who knows? Maybe with the changes Holy won’t have to be Oracle for it’s only source of emergency burst healing.
Thought about this one for M+. Maybe Lightwell can be used now as a proper cooldown alongside Divine hymn and Apotheosis
I really don’t want to have to be keeping track of resources and cooldowns as a Holy Priest. I liked that we were a reactive healer and went with the flow. Now we’re going to have to make sure we’re saving up our four Lightweaver thingies and pop Apotheosis when damage comes out?
What’s our raid healing going to look like now, 70% Halo and then the rest as Whack-A-Mole Flash Heal.
Well… this is literally the actual gameplay.
As for this, hpriest will still remain a reactive healer. Even better now because it’s getting better AoE healing by adding PoH on modifiers like Resonant words and Lightweaver.
The talent tree still has problems in the bottom part but I managed to add lightwell + lightweaver + divine image for a M+ build.
Live hpriest for M+ also is a cooldown management spec, if you are playing 12+ keys you need to save up cooldowns and rotate between them carefully to be able to heal mechanics.
I feel this change does not change that, but opens up different ways to AoE heals.
Guardian Angel sharing node with Restitution is cringe, if we could get restitution without losing GA that would give us some sort of defensive by self rezing.
Overall the talent tree is better than what we had, eventhough we still lack utility, mobility and things like better dispel profile.
It just needs a bit of iteration and improvement
Bruh, that’s what it already looked like. Please look at a better Holy’s breakdown.
Hopefully they continue to iterate more before the patch comes in. As a disc, I feel like these are interesting changes, although, at a glance, it feels like we’re flipping completely into oracle 
I like rapture, but I find it tedious to manually apply the shields one by one, so I’m curious to see how it will go 
I would have preferred they split the barrier node and have luminous barrier be put in place of rapture instead of evang (or bake them into the same talent, like having evang shield instead of heal or maybe having luminous barrier or evang as a choice node could be interresting also )
Some say that the mana of disc is taking a hit, but to be fair… you can hardly oom atm as a VW… Seems only like a legit nerf!
I’m a bit flabbergasted that they didnt do ANY change on the class tree…
I’m going to post my thoughts on Disc now.
Overall the Disc tree changes are pretty solid. Disc should shoot up in raid healing, but will lose out in M+ popularity IMHO.
I’m curious to see how it goes with the changes to sw:pain / potw though…
Although I can see TE being something for oracle more than for VW
Expiation might be interesting with damage to sw:pain increased though? (I’ve still got my doubts on this one but it will be better than current… will it be enough? not sure…)
TE and Expiation are hold overs on how Disc used to play with Harsh Discipline back before the revamp in DF. You used to have 2 charges of Mindblast and it was a 8s cd.
Yeah, I’m not saying that your question isn’t valid. But I think both talents gain a bit from the changes at least
TE has been a dead talent for a while now, but with their intention on moving healing/dmg outside the windows a bit, it makes sw:pain + smite maybe an ok baseline for a light and shadow alternation without thinking too much about it.
for example: you can start a fight with a smite to empower you sw:pain to spread the empowered sw:pain into other target with an empowered penance, then mind blast (+ expiation both in play here) then smite. All of that is empowered by TE and this is the basic rotational pattern for disc.
Plus, sw:pain and smite are buffed baseline as well, making this whole thing more meaningful too. Just having our dot being a shadow spell makes TE a lot more useable without having to focus that much on the rotation element. This doesnt mean every smite should be empowered by TE, but refrehsing our sw:pain here and there between penance/smites isn’t too far fetched either or poping smite between sw:deaths
The whole thing is incorporated more fluidly into the spec at least
Expiation is an annoying talent to work around as well because casting Mind Blast can remove SWP from the target which requires recasting it again. There’s just better things to put 2 points in imho.
Eh…not sure about that. It’s great that holy lost some more 2-pointers. Discipline didn’t lose any. Shadow has no changes at all. Of course, there’s probably more forthcoming (cope), but reducing 2-pointers for discipline off the bat should be effortless and there’s no reason they couldn’t have done it in this first build, and completely omitting class and shadow changes after their failure in in alpha/beta/11.0/11.0.5/11.0.7 is a bad look.
But, as for what they did do, I’m at least intrigued despite how weird some of it is and how many glaring omissions there are (hi, Twilight Equilibrium).
But I have to give them credit - they did finally find a way to get people to take Contrition.
That’s what it already looks like, yeah, and it was bad. The complaint was that our spells like Renew, CoH, and PoM should have been significant contributors in raid and they were underpowered, Halo was responsible for us not sucking in raid, and we sucked in M+ because PoM was useless, renew was useless, and CoH didn’t move bars…
So they gutted the existing raid playstyle in order to give us Prayer of Healing usefulness in dungeons, but it’s going to be useless in raid due to it not being a smart heal.
I honestly just hate the drastic change. I hate having to change the way I learned to play not but a year ago. All they had to do was buff a couple of spells. Instead they redesigned it… again.
I mean, it’s all apotheosis now. Gotta build up stacks of lightweaver and pop apotheosis for the big damage phases. They got rid of our big cooldown. I liked having big cooldowns. I liked really changing the tide in a big battle.
I’m sure the M+ people will be happy with the changes. I’m not and I’m not looking forward to trying to manage this new talent tree that looks like we’re going to have to make some tough choices in, mostly at the bottom.
Yes but i used to use it to empower my dots and spread, which becomes more viable now with PtW being shadow. I very much like expiation swd in execute range, can lay on hands the entire party, but struggle to find the point for it so skip it. They do need to add something else to it maybe. I enjoy playing oracle and always take TE with it, a nice pws for pious, swd then empowered holy nova is some very nice dps.
I agree with your basic assessment of disc.
DA with direct Harsh discipline penance sounds nice, and with inspiration is bound to get that proc plus contrition being baseline you get some value there and the new oracle penance bolt spray ability
Someone at blizz is REALLY desperate to see renew worth existing.
I mean idk. Have you read Empowered Renew? If I’m reading this right it put a 12 SECOND COOLDOWN on Renew.
Renew.
Like someone pls correct me if I’m wrong but this just looks like a smoking crater in the talent tree. Not that Renew was good to begin with but they made it worse lol.
This Holy talent tree feels awful.
There’s still way too much point bloat. By the time you get down to the meat of the tree where all the big changes were made you can’t take any of it! I’m literally wasting 5 points higher up the tree in nonsense trying to get down and then you get down there and hit the remaining excess of 2 pt bloaters and just get screwed.
No take talents. Only changes.
WTG.
Anyway, this is what I came up with.
CEQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMLMzYWGzwMzMjZmZsMDDAAAAAAAAAAAgCAgZ2sNZ2MAkxgNWMLD
This entire build is based on casting renew through means where I don’t actually cast it and hoping it benefits from the empowered renew talent. In addition to buffing POH and healing output in every possible way to increase aoe healing. If Answered Prayers benefits from the new Divinity talent I feel like that can be worked with.
Oh I’m sure it was. But I don’t really care about M+. I didn’t take CoH for my Mythic+ build and that’s okay. Talents don’t have to be useful in both raid and Mythic+.
TBH, I’ve never been fond of Apo for raiding. It’s just a “me” thing, though.
I don’t know if the Lightweaver change actually gives more options, because I think most people will feel they need to take it.
I’m surprised more people aren’t pointing out how bad it is. Like I’d feel like I’m actively hurting myself if I took that talent. The benefit is so marginal. +60% on one renew that still has no mastery scaling. Everyone should be skipping this talent in my opinion.
That old Empowered Renew that gave us 40% of the HoT upfront in immediate healing was so much better than this trash. Hard casted renews felt a lot better to use but not to the point you’d ever spam renew.