someone never played wow in the days of needing CC or Kiting a boss. Like Alexi Barov in scholomance or General Drak in Ubers.
1 Like
I means its part of Evoker’s design being “here’s most of Rshams utility but with huge caveats”.
Don’t get me wrong i’m aware Pres Evoker is S Tier and what’s unique about it is really really powerful but yeah.
And i also play Rdruid and thats often when i feel like pulling my hairs out if people don’t kick.
My point is just that the higher you go in content difficulty the less it feels like i can carry as a Healer since mistakes aren’t recoverable through simple healing and that feels kinda bad.
I think the problem is that some mobs just spam cast.
Sometimes I’ll use my felguard kick/stun and after the stun they just continue casting, because my interrupt is also a stun.
Makes things on the final boss of NO a tad more annoying because I can’t kick to group playing demo. And mobs like the cinderbolt mobs in RLP just spam cast.
1 Like
And I have already agreed if its just for a back up with a long CD, that is one thing. I think we all need one… I have a Rdruid and this Hpriest. I have never said that I dont think it something that we cant have but to put us in a a kick rotation while we are watching where we stand, the whole groups healthbars and anything else going, right now that is just nonsense.
We could DPS and prolly pull this off in SL but in DF, I dont have much time to stop healing let alone worry about is my kick next.
If they’re gonna continue to have an absurd amount of interrupts required, all CDs need to be 12 seconds.
2 Likes
Would also be nice if they could redesign the enemy cast bar to have some sort of meaningful information so we can play the game, not memorize the dungeon. It’s always a game of knowing what needs to be interrupted with what ability and I’ve yet to find any correlation between what needs to be interrupted with what type of ability and the color of the cast bar.
2 Likes
This isnt new. I regularly did 40+ interrupts in most dungeons in slands too. Yes there are more in DF, but not many more.
Uh ? Tidal burst is a long cast and is not cast that often.
You’re not trying to interrupt every hydrolances are you ?
survival, rogue and lock is 2 melee, 1 ranged.
Are you confused ?
You didnt read the original post lmao
I’m replying to someone about a comment they made.
Ruby is very bad, we average 90-100 interrupts on each person in the group tank/melee/melee, ranged does around 50.
Because CC would make the meta even worse.
Not all classes can CC a mob type in a dungeon.
Imagine being declined all the time cause say a shaman cant shackle ghost mobs, by all means
Its already like this, if i was a new wow player today id likely quit once i reached endgame. Half the stuff requires some addons or weak auras to complete now. And the mechanics stacked on mechanics stacked on mechanics design is boring. They dont even come up with new mechanics or interesting fights.
I think DF is going to represent peak complexity for wow before the devs realize this isnt eve online and new players arent going to stick around for a complex convoluted mess.
2 Likes
No. Problem is, everyone else does. Therefore, it becomes my responsibility to interrupt and my CD isn’t finished by the next round.
I mean, maybe a bias take here but all-ranged DPS groups shouldn’t be a thing.
Just like there is pressure to take heroism and battle res, there should also be pressure to take 1 short kicker in the DPS department (eg besides the tank).
If an optimum group is all melee or all ranged, theres a design problem.
Right now, kicks and hard cc are in very high demand, which creates pressure for melee who can help with this.
Likewise, there’s lots of bosses where having a ranged is pretty important to success (last 2 bosses in AV, last boss RLP, multiple bosses in HoV, second boss NO) simply because of how much these bosses impact uptime, never mind the anti-melee bias of most affixes.
And as much as everyone likes to pretend “traditional cc is dead in keys” I’m pretty convinced at this point that being able to frost trap / banish a haunting sha on the last pull of TJS or a scepter/book when double or triple pulling the Vexamus AA platform is much more likely to result in timing the key than not doing so.
Except some dungeons are insufferable without perfect play. RLP has the elemental pack first on the left which has two casters in it. Both casters need two melee assigned to each in order for NOTHING to get through and no one to whiff a kick. That’s unreasonable in any level of PUG group where if the cinderbolt during inferno raidwide or on the person with the knock up goes off the target gets 100-0’ed.
That trash has somehow dodged nerfs every single week and I don’t get how. ToP had a lot of required kicks in SL, but the casts that outright killed people had cooldowns (bone spear/necrotic bolt volley). The cinderbolts upstairs have no cooldown and all do 50-60% of people’s health on higher fort keys.
The other issue is a lot of casters aren’t “dual schooled” so specs like SPriest just have a bad kick for the sake of having a bad kick. The difference between Silence and Kick/Wind Shear for the Cinderbolt casters is absolutely nothing because Kick also fire school locks them for the duration of SPriest’s hard silence at 1/4 the cooldown.
You realise you don’t need to kick every Cinderbolt.
It’s not exactly Death Blast from SMBG.
If you are open to addons, invest in Plater. You can download profiles so you don’t even have to bother setting it up yourself. Lots of nice ones people have set up (you can find them on wago.io same as weakauras) including options to highlight primary target mobs or mobs with important casts going off …
But even just with a simple default layout, it’ll be way easier for you to spot what is a “kick this” cast and what is a “stun this” cast on enemy nameplates.
I agree with you in respect to CC’ing mobs. However, the concept seems to run anathema. And usually the packs that do represent problems in the instances involve one or more mobs impossible to CC. Like the elementals at the start of Jade Temple, who by themselves have been the bane of many-a-hunter.
However, I disagree with the mentality that you should have “diverse” groups, or that it is the focus of design. It may not be the best way to compare, but if you look at the raider .io ladder, there is a huge prevalence of melee in the higher timed keys. Even a good number of triple melee teams. Why is that? I detect three possibilities:
- Higher frequency interrupting;
- Higher, upfront, “bursty” damage;
- Less vulnerable to mechanics/affixes, save for sanguine(?).
You do see the oddball demo warlock there in the middle, or balance druid. These two classes have very strong AoE potential and a good deal of utility. But the simplicity of, for example, DH and rogue AoE setup, coupled with in-built reliable defensive measures, high damage, mobility and control, stand out when the philosophy of M+ is “doing the most damage possible, the quickest possible, while ignoring the most mechanics you can.”
I’d also throw in how melee seems to have an easier time shifting between ST and AoE, in part because most of the AoE from their original kits has not been moved to the talent trees, like it happened with… pretty much every warlock spec. If I spec single target, it is LITERALLY single target. Not even a fart does AoE.
This, with the addition to… Well, having to cast, makes caster groups more vulnerable in M+ encounters. Not to mention how repositioning - the bane of melee in past iterations - has become a cakewalk due to in-built numerous gap closers, and passive +speed effects from enchants, self-buffs, etc.