Just venting
Once again in another key where another tank is refusing a drop in agro between pulls, mocking my 3.xM dps, then when trying to say to the tank, “hey, assassination needs a break in pulls to stealth every so often” told “just reroll”.
I’m tired of how broken and frustratingly forgotten we are. It’s beyond unacceptable that to have a smooth run, it’s required to have a premade group (as assassination). It’s taking everything out of me to not hard cancel my sub. I despise how dependent we are on stealth (as assassination) and it’s inexcusable after several seasons nothing has been done about it.
Why not let assassination rogues hold our own cooldowns/class function in our own hands? How hard is it to insert a passive “after 5 (or x) amount of honor or exp gaining kills one refreshes their stealth/vanishing ability”? Heck keep it in theme and call it “Finished Contract”. This way assassination stays in line with all other specs/classes and stops being a pita to play in pugs.
1-2 Edit: Grammar as I’m beyond frustrated and trying to reasonably state my frustrations
6 Likes
Just ignore that idiot.
Sadly Sin is very reliant on double Vanish for this reason, sometimes i go out of my way to NOT move into the next pack so im not considered to be in combat with it so i can re-stealth before it.
But yeah, its the tank’s job to pay attention to his party and plan pulls accordingly, that tank was just terrible cause hes actively sabotaging you by refusing to let you stealth, not much different from a tank that ignores the healer’s mana.
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It’s just frustration to be a spec that has to rely on a tanks whims to do optimal dps. If a tank works with me I can hit 3.8-4.5 (depending on the key), but only 3.1-3.5 if they’re not.
It’s beyond absurd to lose 1/4 my dps because a tank refuses to slow down and there’s zero I can do about it.
2 Likes
Dont worry. Mafic will be in shortly to tell you why Vanish instead of Shadow Dance was simply a good move.
Anyway the issues you are dealing with are why i havent so much as touched Sin since the xpac released. I already get tilted enough when tanks pull a boss without letting me stealth even as Sub.
It’s especially bad this season because several items actively promote staying in combat / chain pulling constantly (Eye of Kezan etc.), not to mention one of the most popular specs rn (ret with Divine Hammer). Many healers are nelf and can meld drink (if they even need mana) so even that doesn’t get you a pause any more.
I’ve seen numbers thrown about like its only a 3% dps loss if you don’t get a re but in practice it feels a lot different to that - at least on big packs.
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BlizZard hasn’t helped much with Rogues this expansion so we understand!
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The only numbers I’ve heard thrown around is specifically from Whispyr when he talked about running sims with raidbots, and his findings with raidbots were a 15% dps loss.
HOWEVER
The issue is that it’s not a simable situation, it’s not just 5 mob and a boss every so often. The sim is not taking into account the health of mobs, the mechanics in the dungeons of target swaps and dodging damage, etc. Yeah sure, on packs of 5 it’s not a big loss especially if one is walking in with full energy. It’s however a massive loss when the tank pulls into a group of 6+ with low energy because they decided to walk in with only one mob remaining at 30% health and now having to spend time throwing ruptures and garrotes up while trying to do mechanics + make sure darkest night doesn’t fall away so wasting mutes to stick it on something while I can build up my bleeds for proper energy regeneration. It becomes an absurd dps loss vs having stealth and being able to spread 3 garrotes and ruptures within just 3 gcds let alone spreading to the whole pack if they’re long lasting mobs.
So in reality and away from isolated sims, it’s a massive dps loss of what I’m consistently finding of closer to 20%-25% with a tank that refuses to pump the breaks every so often. What’s worse is that it’s not even a full second out of combat, all it requires is simply combat to drop and in less than a full second I’m in stealth.
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I feel your pain. The worst is when you see them drag a lone 10% hp mob over to the next pack and you desperately try to hang back and solo finish it off yourself, but even if you do you probably get into global combat somehow from an aoe or something.
2 Likes
yeah… its a problem… hit button smash. dont let rogue break combat.
ive come to just accept it… even accept blame for lack of dps.
my own guild leader chain pulled an entire mythic keystone dungeon. pulled extra agro and ignored it… just kept going. slowed everything down because he didnt want to wait 1 second between pulls. that is all it takes… 1 SECOND BETWEEN PULLS.
literally then said i was the problem… i almost left my guild because of the disrespect…
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Rogues are built for old WoW. They are not formatted to keep up with this new style of Zerg play. Every design for rogues that doesn’t bother to look at the play style of other players will fail.
This is why I keep saying our dps can’t be built around stealth. It needs to be built around finishers.
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What are your thoughts on if we had vanish on a way shorter cooldown? (I’m not thinking of PVP though) but I think it’d be a great novelty for PVE.
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Hmm interesting, but I fear other classes may call hax. That and stealth is already buggy.
Now I would be down for an all in one attack button that stealthed you and hit massively hard on one move without buildup. But I am a dreamer 
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hahaha that’s true but I feel like some other classes have a lot more cooler stuff at this point.
I also wondered if we could just get the ability to restealth after maybe:
- not getting hit for a few seconds
- distance from aggroed enemies (idk how easy that is code-wise)
- line of sight (like D&D?)
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Don’t worry, you’ll always be there to talk down to someone as soon as they express an opinion different to yours. You’re keeping us above the rest mate, keep up the good work.
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“Help I play the best rogue spec in the game who is great at nearly every avenue of the content and I’m begging blizzard to fix the only weak spot of the spec”
Every spec for every class has strengths and weaknesses, blizzard should be spending more time fixing other rogue specs and let assassination flourish as it has already been doing all season.
No denying Assassination is a top tier spec but the energy issues and inability stealth as much as Outlaw and Sub should be addressed.
… ok?
Sub has always been better this entire xpac. Just undertuned.
This is why the Rogue forum is full of diverse opinions and perspective for we are the elite of the elite of the WoW player base to still make Rogue work in current modern content.
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its barely a weakness too, being unable to stealth is lowkey kinda irrelevant to the amount of damage you gain from chain pulling
A weakness is a weakness.
Ret has one small weakness and next thing you know they beg to have the mobility of a warrior, the heals of Druids, and the Rogue CC.
That is why Assassination needs help!
If it is good enough for Ret to receive buffs then it is good enough to see Assassination with buffs!