Imo it’s just filler content. Heroic diffculty is what guilds actually push, so deleting it and having LFR and the new dungeon system take its place just makes sense to me. LFR’s rewards and difficulty can be scaled up some to compensate but this basically would allow a more casual player to just grind dungeons and do LFR and be ready to do heroic with an active guild. To me, normal doesn’t fill a real niche in the raid rungs. LFR is more valuable because it’s more accessible and if you start raiding late in the tier, you’re basically screwed because any normal guild is done with normal by that point, so you don’t have a good path forward other than grinding M+.
8 Likes
Normal raids are starter raiding. People don’t learn to raid in LFR. Eliminating entry level raiding would be a mistake.
61 Likes
LFR and Normal raids still seem like pretty different niches. LFR is for the loner types like myself. Normal is for people with friends who still want to complete the content but in a chill way. Hell it’s probably easier than LFR since they can communicate better and help their friends.
15 Likes
but for the people who take the time to organize 20+ other people are they usually doing it to not get AOTC? I’ve never seen a guild whose end goal is normal on any advert, and hence I don’t think it has a purpose.
I literally learned most of the mechanics for Antorus in LFR before raiding in earnest.
2 Likes
The thing I don’t understand about threads like this is, do they really think there is not enough skill difference between different WoW players to justify multiple difficulties of content? (If so, LOL.)
People have vastly different amounts of time to devote to WoW and most forms of skill come from practice. And spending more time on one character will also get that character better gear, which increases the performance difference far beyond the skill (i.e. experience) difference. That’s why we have lots of difficulty levels and they are all suited to someone.
Also, if guilds are done with normals, there are probably pug normals. (Actually, even before a lot of guilds are done with normals, there will be pug normals, but you might have a hard time getting in without AotC.)
P.S. You can learn mechanics in LFR if you pay attention, because if you are paying attention you can notice things even if they don’t oneshot you. But that doesn’t make it a good idea to demand that anyone jump from LFR straight to heroic.
7 Likes
Considering how low aotc is compared to normal clear
Nah, leave normal raid alone
6 Likes
There are guilds out there who progress normal like some guilds progress mythic. Why would you want to take content away from those people?
I have a friend in a raid guild where and it takes them almost 2 months clear normal , then another 2-3 months to complete heroic.
Something tells me there are a lot more guilds enjoying normal than you think. I know it might sound weird, but I am sure there guilds out there who never clear heroic. They get a few bosses into heroic and that’s it. Normal is their bread and butter.
12 Likes
My guild hasn’t raided for progression since Mists. We only run Normal if we even run raids. No, we aren’t pushing anything. No, we don’t want to deal with random pugs in LFR.
Your idea is not a good one.
18 Likes
Don’t need friends really. On weeks I had free time, I could get 3-4 alts through full clears of amirdrassil, full pugs, with all 3 roles covered. (Warlock, DK (tank) Evoker (heal)). For warlock it probably was faster to do normal than LFR.
Now, having AotC might have helped a bit.
1 Like
Looking For Raid and Normal or Normal and Heroic should be condensed into one another.
5 Likes
There is almost never a reason to delete a difficulty. The point of having multiple difficulties is to meet players wherever they are.
No one is hurt by having normal raid, but people would be hurt by removing it.
16 Likes
Why though? What would be the point?
2 Likes
That’s why I still hold on it should have been like this.
Normal and LFR merge, having LFR’s queueability, but Normal’s difficulty. Naturally guilds can just run in if they desire.
But Blizzard and Players have conditioned everyone to just accept being everyone is actually bad at this game so that’s likely never gonna happen.
1 Like
Instead of encouraging and promoting players to get better.
Less spread of players leading to faster formation of groups, larger player pool for the remaining three raid difficulties, and reduce item level bloat. Blizzard is already doing it for dungeons, so I’m hopefully they’ll give the same treatment to raids.
That’s what I’ve been saying for about a year now.
Some mechanics in normal would just be a disaster in a queue system. Just look at Fyrakk, in LFR, first phase firestorm can be dropped anywhere since they don’t create patches of fire. Imagine if it did like every other difficulty.
1 Like
No. I don’t want to pug with toxic random people.
Removing Normal means I’ll never raid ever again. It doesn’t “encourage” anything.
3 Likes
You’re implying that players who exclusively raid Looking For Raid difficulty cannot or will not learn mechanics. The soft bigotry of low expectations.
Ok, bye.
I am 100% fine with there being actual mechanics in queueable content, so that people actually you know…learn.
But as stated; we don’t want people to learn, because people (not me of course no no no) are too stupid to do so. So this idea is really just ramblings of a madman.
IMO just delete LFR and make normal Lfr
I mean. I run LFR on a handful of toons each week, and I genuinely wonder if a lot of people who frequent LFR can hang in a normal raid.
I can’t imagine taking an LFR group into a normal Council encounter where they don’t share health pools.
A lot of people on the Tindral fight can’t make it from platform to platform in LFR. There’s an added mechanic in the flight phase in normal.
On Fyrakk people drop tornadoes in melee range and can’t handle dispels or healing the adds.
Etc. etc.
These kinds of things are less punishing in LFR and that’s why I think having LFR and Normal separated is appropriate. There are people of different skill levels even at the lower end of content difficulty.
4 Likes