To be fair, this was Vanilla-Wrath, even into Cata and MoP. The Alliance players were always berated by some neutral faction for our, ‘petty hatred,’ of the Horde, and that was during a time a lot of Alliance players didn’t really hate the Horde. If anything being told over and over by the likes if Tirion and Taran Zhu that I am a terrible person for hating the Horde, when I didn’t hate the Horde, actively made me hate the Horde.
I guess that’s why I don’t have a hard time seeing why Horde players hate Jaina as a symbol of their bad writing.
eh, as a jaina fan i think that how they portrayed her after the raid was unnecessary.
other than that, she was just a victim of different writers one trying to write her in the benefit of horde players and another in benefit for alliance players, i am glad that the last one prevailed and cemented her character, she is the best thing from bfa.
but sadly that doesn’t say much considering the poor quality of the story.
and to be honest all that thing with theramore was good for her character considering that arthas was gone, she needed something that changed her character, because thanks to that it delivered probably the storyline that i enjoyed the most in the history of wow and that was kultiras and the proudmoores. it was… it is great.
probably one of the few things that are well written, because other things and power levels are always as much as the plot or the raid tier demands. i am not going to defend power levels. always inconsistent.
other thing that i actually love is how she kicked the horde so many times this xpac after all what they did to her, i am satisfied with her being the simbol of their hate. but i don’t blame them either.
I dunno, I honestly feel like the faction hate was worse during Cata than it is now.
Now seems more exasperated. Cata era was visceral and a lot of posters were incredibly mean spirited.
Hell, during Wrath, the forums would explode into heated arguments over things like Ashenvale, Alterac Valley and Lordaeron. even back then, both factions accused the other of having Blizzard’s biased, and threw around arguments of morals and hatred.
There’s always been massive faction hatred between fans of both factions, and I honestly don’t know if I would say it’s any worse now than it’s ever been. Honestly, I feel like we’re getting more people becoming sick of the faction conflict on this forum than ever before.
I just don’t agree that we’re seeing more faction hatred now than ever.
Cataclysm brought it out for certain, but I remember in Wrath when Varian attacked Thrall in the Undercity and called him a, ‘Green-Skinned Aberration,’ Alliance players were up in arms over the hatred of him. How dare he talk to THRALL like that! How DARE he start a War with the Horde?!
Really? I remember the opposite. Many Alliance players agreed with him because they wanted Ashenvale and Lordaeron back. They wanted what Varian argued for- war. And many Horde players wanted to rise to the challenge, cause he attacked Thrall. And many just wanted war.
Though, you’re right that Varian had a massive bad wrap, as did Garrosh, back in Wrath. I think it was more when rather than how. The Lich King and Yogg-Saron were the bigger threats, so many saw the warmongering of Varian and Garrosh as ill timing and badly thought out, and at the time we didn’t have ‘end of the world’ fatigue like we do now.
Of course, I do not claim the opinion of every player. Diversity and what not. Not all Alliance players now want war, and not all players then wanted it.
I mean, you really can’t boil down so many opinions to a singular cause. I’m sure plenty of people have plenty of reasons to dislike Jaina’s character. Even your opening statement is incorrect. Someone has always hated Jaina.
Personally, I don’t hate her, but I can also understand why others might.
As Vexander said, Jaina is a living reminder of the Horde’s decline. The Horde had been reimagined in Warcraft 3 as redeemable, a people worthy of a continued existence who could atone of their past deeds. It’s what Horde players were sold. And Jaina (along with a few other characters) were the main supporters of that idea, even to the chagrin of some Alliance players.
Then, the story had them fail at that redemption and jump straight back into being villains again. And Jaina is that failure personified.
At the same time, there could be many other reasons. Some dislike how powerful she has become as an individual. Others disliked how her character flip-flopped back in Cata/MoP. And I’m sure many other reasons.
As a faction, the Horde isn’t guilty of anything that the United States as a country itself hasn’t done, and we’re not flagellating ourselves for our history. There isn’t a single reason that a Horde player should feel guilty as Sylvannas can come up with a justification for every rotten thing she’s done.
The fact that Alliance NPC’s and players may dispute those justifications is not the Horde player’s problem.
Someone said it before but as an Alliance main I’m ready for Jaina to just die because of how she’s constantly flip flopping. “The Horde must be eradicated.”
Dazar’alor happens
“Press the advantage??? While their grieving?!?! How could you!!!???!!?!?!”
She’s beyond inconsistent and just another human character bloated with “potential” make her a Blood thirsty monster or just kill her off already.
This is the complaint I’ve always seen regarding Jaina, not whatever the OP was trying to fish for. People complained because she was the main female representation in the story and her narrative always shifted between silly little girl and frigid ice queen. Everyone said she was a poorly written female character.
The thing is though, if you actually look at how Thrall went about the rebuilding of the Horde, it’s not hard to figure out why the Horde has declined. We can argue forever on whether that was intentional on Blizzard’s part, but what we know for a fact is that the “Redeemable Horde” is not a dream yet achieved. Thrall’s Horde of WC3 had a conflict with the Alliance, unprovoked attacked the natives, and had a civil war before they could even finish settling. Thrall condemned the actions of the Old Horde while allowing many of it’s practices to continue, such as Warlocks and Slavery, and glorified the many War Criminals of it’s era. He settled the traditionally nomadic and War like Horde in a desolate place as a means of repentance, setting them up for failure. And when it was his time to bamf out, he put the hot headed Hellscream in charge for, frankly, what can be considered racist reasoning.
So, we can call it bad writing, but I think it all makes sense, and Sylvanas’ evil needed to be confronted at some point. Maybe that aspect could of been handled better, but I don’t think anything would of appeased the old school Forsaken fans, at the very least.
Actually I’ve found this to feel a lot less like flip-flopping, a lot more in line with the balanced person she’s become. She wants peace, but she’ll fight for the Alliance’s interest. In this case, peace is a lot more attainable after the war is over if the Alliance isn’t stooping to Sylvanas’ levels. If the attack had been pressed, Zandalar would’ve fallen and forever been a hard enemy of the Alliance. Now, if peace comes, the Zandalari will need to accept that and assuage their hatreds in whatever measure of comeuppance they can doll out to the Alliance before peace arrives.
I hated her in ToW when she became a massive hypocrite and forgot that her actions were the impetus for the destruction of Theramore because she invaded most of the Horde zones on Kalimdor. People see her as a poor victim or a tragic survivor when she’s actually a character that was ruined even worse than Garrosh.
You can use whatever reason you want to justify her behavior. Either way, it means that she became a full participant in the Alliance’s war on the Horde and that made her city a legitimate military target.
You mean when the Warsong went into a seemingly uninhabited forest and saw what they thought were ghosts (wisps) and heard an unknown language which they assumed came from the ghosts? And were then attacked without any warning beyond a ghostly voice speaking in a language they didn’t understand? Self defense is now an unprovoked attack?
I assume you’re referring to the Quillboar and Centaur who were driving the Tauren to extinction and the Naga who were about to wipe out the Darkspear? Look up the definition for “indiscriminately”.
so is fine to just attack whoever you want?,she was part of the alliance. she had an obligation. and she saved the horde like 3 times already. (grom,daelin,undercity)
no it wasn’t, it would be out of character that she attacked the horde randomly.