I have difficulty understanding why the game developers feel a pressing need to punish players instead of rewarding them.
Designing mythic plus so that rewards drop off radically for failing to time the key is the reason players are leaving early. That and toxicity, which is largely the result of anger - because of failing to time the key.
Instead of punishing players so harshly for failure to meet the clock, why don’t you just make the clock part of mythic keystone master and stop wasting our time by screwing us out of crests when we hit 31 minutes instead of 30.
What other content do you get rewarded for failure? If anything M+ rewards failure too much by still giving 2 end of dungeon drops and counting towards vault.
In reality you’re only failing a portion of the challenge, so you’re still succeeding on many levels.
There are already significant penalties attached to missing a timer in terms of increased time investment, consumables, repairs, unclaimed m+ score, depleted key, etc.
Also, there is nothing so sacred about crests that they should be protected do greedily. If anything, the threat of losing crests just discourages players from pushing to the next key level. More than enough deterrents already exist to intimidate players
The actual number of penalties for failing a single, albeit important, facet of the content is already sufficient that I don’t think there needs to be a crest penalty. For the record, this really wouldn’t benefit me, but , but importantly I don’t think it would negatively impact me either. These groups will have still defeated the primary challenge, which is to achieve mob count and defeat all the bosses.
I personally think m+ would be much better if groups had more reason to complete a dungeon even if the timer was gone.
As much as I think the timer is integral to m+, I think the impact it has on engagement is more significant than many are willing to admit. Not sure if anything could be changed, but I think it’s important to look at ways to make m+ worthwhile to the very many players who have thrown in the towel already this season.
Other than a key depletion which raids don’t have, these things are all penalties of failing a raid encounter. You spend more time, more repairs, more consumables, and you don’t get your raid progression. You also get no loot and no crests, and no vault, instead of full loot, full vault, and partial crests.
Completing a raid encounter can also be far more rewarding. You cannot get tier or rare drops from end of dungeon chests.
The main problem I have is that there’s this sliding scale of “importance” where nothing happens to crests until it’s time to forfeit some.
Runed crests are rewarded from +4 to +7. If a group can easily time a +4, crests are not sacred. They are literally easily available. But if a group wants to press themselves and try harder content, those almost free crests suddenly take on some precious additional value, even though the content they complete is harder?
That’s just an unnecessary double-standard that does nothing to advance the quality of the content, it literally just discourage players from moving up for fear of losing out.
WoW doesn’t need to discourage players from approaching content. Many of them are already intimidated and anxious to start with.
False, if you get a chest, helm, shoulder, hands, or legs, you can catalyse them for tier.
If a group can easily time a +4 for crests, there is no reason to go to +6. If the group tries, and can time a +6 with relative ease then they have enough gear and skill to try a +7. Once that group is timing 7s there is no reason to do anything under a 7. The next jump is +8. Gilded crests. Its called progression. If your group is fearful of losing out then keep working away at what you can do until you’re comfortable to move up.
M+ is still the most rewarding feature of the game, regardless of timing a key or not, you get end of dungeon rewards no matter what.
For me, thats not the reason I leave keys. If I do happen to leave a key its because we’ve wiped on the same boss 3+ times without getting them close to down.
It’s close, but not equal by any means. Catalyst charges are limited and end of dungeon does not reward mythic track.
Either way, that’s not my point. I simply disagree with getting less crests for failing the timer. I’m not sure which is best, and ultimately it doesn’t affect me that much, which is part of my point.
From my personal experience people are burning out on the amount of failure attached to m+. Keys demand a level of attention and depth of focus that is gradually becoming more than people are willing to commit. We can call them lazy or bad at the game all we want but at this rate it won’t matter. The skill floor is being raised ever closer to the ceiling and soon enough there will be no chill m+, just hardcore pass/fail mechanics from wall to wall.
I can play just well enough to keep ahead of the pack, but I genuinely feel bad for the average player when considering the state of m+. It’s not fun for a lot of them where it used to be.
I want less reasons for players to resent playing the game. I don’t think it’s a deal-breaker, I’m not calling for change, I’m just putting in my thoughts out there.
I get that.
A couple of my friends were turned off M+ this season because of the key changes.
I more enjoyed the 2-20 style over the 2-10 style. Even if lower keys 2-10 became redundant, it was still nice to have a softer opening for alts and for people who were not as committed.
I liked puahing to 15+ and finally working my way towards 20, it felt more natural and the progression was much smoother. Also, from my experience, people stayed for more keys from 2-15 and you didnt really see people leaving until 20+ where, at that point, it was purely for score