Rather than derailing other threads, or having very specific posters, derail them for me, seems easier to just ask it here. is mythic plus making this game better or worse? aside from your personal opinion and enjoyment or displeasure with it, overall for the entire community and the game itself are things better or worse than they were during Mists of Pandaria?
It makes the game better. It gives players a way to practice their specs as much as they want in infinity scaling content. No other part of the game offers that.
If you’re pushing yourself as a player you could go into heroic raid all week, but there’s a point where you need something harder and you can’t just spam mythic raid.
Also it’s fun, but that’s just my opinion.
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I think the mode should not inform so much on development as it obviously does right now. Class design, dungeon design, reward structure, seasonal pacing etc are all being “shaped” around myth plus as a core gameplay tenet, instead of it being just one mode among many.
It means no cool RP spells, no innovation in class design or dungeons, no change-ups on the reward structure front etc.
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If wow was like it used to be, adventurous, dangerous, ominous, expansive, more difficult enemies in open world etc… then M+ would be hurting it. But it’s not. They made wow too easy from level 1 and it forced them into making difficult content so they made M+ to scale keys to the highest difficulty people could get them to.
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Would you say the game would feel more or less dangerous had they not added zone scaling? Or do you feel that maybe the zone scaling is not as accurate as it could be based on the amount of power we have?
Who hurt you 
weird way to start a thread.
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That was a potshot at a certain Goblin Shaman who picks fights in every thread with more than just me 
But, since there is no naming and shaming, I figured it would be easier to keep it vague.
better.
m+ was the single best thing added to the game since flying.
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I see. Well, my opinion is that M+ is awesome as it retains players better than anything else in the game. I understand the argument and stretches people make about the overarching game becoming more “elitist” in favor of M+ players, but… It is still very casual friendly with plenty of alternative ways to gear and have fun, whilst never touching M+. Look at the myriad of Delvers proclaiming they will never do M+ despite being given a +2 key. And honestly, good for them! They should not do it if they don’t want to. That’s the beauty of this game.
The mental gymnastics people put on to justify their seething hatred towards M+ and its players is comedic to read. At the end of the day, it is completely optional to participate in M+. Lets take a step back and remember this is a video game, and you are not being forced to do anything. Your other content is being affected very minimally, if at all, by the existence of M+.
I have absolutely zero ill will towards anyone who doesn’t like M+ and doesn’t want to engage with it. I can think of dozens of reasons why somebody wouldn’t want to do it. One of the coolest things about WoW is that there are so many things to do, and so many things you don’t have to do.
Tl;dr, it is good for the game. It retains players and keeps the endgame alive for many of us who don’t have the time to raid, and want more of a challenge than delves.
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There is always a lot of fighting over it but I’m like………
Don’t participate in it if you don’t like it…… the gear you get from delves seems plenty strong for the content those folks like to participate in.
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Eh, raiding has far more to do with class design than anything.
And m+ didn’t kill dungeon diversity, it’s basically been the same dungeon style since tbc and when they try to do something different, people hate it
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What RP spells have been lost because of M+? I can think of several that were actually given back in recent years.
Lol wut? You don’t think minigames (Mechagon maze, DOTI maze), new mechanics (combat flight in Dawnbreaker), and open dungeon layouts isn’t innovation in dungeons? M+ is likely the sole reason for this, otherwise they’d still be one straight line down a corridor like it was in TBC. Please elaborate on why you feel dungeons and class designs have stagnated because of M+.
You don’t think gear tracks and crests were a change up? How far back are you talking here?
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- They’re timed.
- They have mob cleared prerequisites.
- They guarantee crests.
Better. Raiding is usually a group goal, pushing for a rating goal in M+ can be done completely solo pugging. Without M+, the game would end at Delves for a whole lot of players.
CMs in MoP already had the M+ mindset that was created in Wrath and reinforced by cata dungeons being nerfed, but CMs were all or nothing to get gold time or you didn’t and they didn’t get any easier with gear and when you finished it that was it , all you got was bragging rights tmog.
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What potential design is being restricted because of these things? This is hardly an elaboration. Go on. I’m curious.
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I’m more concerned with all this alt stuff Blizzard is throwing at us. Why are we, the players, making alt-play an engagement metric?
As far as M+ goes, I dunno? Mythic raiding is worse than M+ if you ask me. M+ pulls in sweaty players but it wasn’t really M+ that started all that. Arena did.
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You have to restrict both the length and the overall design in order for players to 3-chest an M+ dungeon.
It also means you’re specifically seeding mobs with certain abilities in order to prevent mass pulls being super effective.
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Much much better. Dungeons are fun and so is pushing keys . The affix concept is good as well at rotating dungeons each season.
I definitely do it as my endgame, however, once I hit ksm I don’t feel the need to grind further.
How so? Megadungeons have been a thing for the past few xpacs. And by the way, you don’t have to +3 a key. In fact you don’t have to time it at all, if you don’t want to. You can find a premade with similar mentality and leisurely enjoy the dungeon at your own pace if you wish. Again, you are not elaborating on “overall design”. Drop the vagueness and give some specific examples of dungeons you feel could have been better, but were restricted by a timer.
But you just said % count is one of the restrictions in design, but now it sounds like you’re all for big pulls and trash kills. I’m confused.
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Nothing sucks the fun out of content more than slapping a timer on it.
M+ hurts both the game and the playerbase.
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