Being Top dps or Bottom dps doesn’t matter one bit in PvE. Bosses will still be downed, loot will still drop. You don’t get Better loot for being top dps. Plus current raids are a joke.
It does matter however in PvP because if your class/spec is gimped you literally can’t even play the game.
I’m a firm believer that things should be balanced more towards PvP. I understand this won’t happen but current classes/specs being broken, whether OP or gimped, make the PvP experience terrible.
Amen.
As long as you’re playing your class well, you will probably be taken to raids.
PvP is the only thing that needs balancing in Classic.
Will they though? Because survey says BZZZZZZT.
IIRC something like 40% of logged runs did not kill Thermaplugg for the first couple resets. I haven’t bothered to look at the logs for that specific metric in about a week but it goes without saying that there are still people failing the raid.
Meanwhile, in PvP, there literally isn’t even a success or failure metric. You can fail your way to Exalted with both WSG and AB. The only PvP progression system you need to actually kill people is STV… oh wait, no, even that isn’t right. In theory if you’re totally soy and bad at PvP you can just farm low level monsters for blood and get the maximum PvP rewards. PvP is completely welfare.
THAT SAID, THAT SAID… yeah I do think PvP balance should be improved when it can be. I also think PvE balance should be improved when it can be. And sometimes when something is completely over the top a nerf to one may effect the other, but that’s just part of making a proper consistent world where the rules are largely the same everywhere.
Have you ever played era? 40 man raids are a minimum 50% warriors. Bringing DPS matters. The second place class in era is considered optional.
PvE progression content dies out pretty fast, everyone figures it out and clears the boss.
However pvp has alot of replayability. Pvp is the stronger of the two motivators for me
I mean to his point we beat Thermaplugg with only 1 proper ranged DPS, as well as 2 Rets and a Warrior which were both bottom-tier DPS. If you’re good players you can find a way through.
That said, with no skill-based matchmaking and with consolation prizes for losing you can also find a way to get Exalted and get your Raptor mount with weak PvP specs. Rogue were bottom-tier for PvP season 1 but I got my Rogue exalted season 1 (I got exalted 3 times - Priest, Mage, and Rogue, so I got to experience top tier, mid tier, and bottom tier exalted grinds in WSG in phase 1) .
Okay. I like PvP a lot too and spend a good chunk of time on it. But even in Classic I would bet that more players play PvE content than PvP content, even when they roll on PvP servers.
PvP outliers should be nerfed, and we’ve seen that happen in phase 1. It’s also probably worth addressing PvE outliers as well.
This is SoD. We are waaaaaaaaaaaay stronger than classic. If you feel PvE content is difficult I feel for you. Even if it is hard, assuming you are in a good guild, you will get into raids and have a chance at gear.
PvP for the most part isn’t even about getting gear but having fun, which it isn’t right now.
And I agree PvE is more populated than PvP which is why I stated the game will never be balanced around PvP. Just PvP is a mess atm.
Sorry you’re not having fun.
I have my Raptor mount on my Mage and I enjoyed it a lot. I’ve taken a break from it to focus on getting my alts up to 40 (and also to just avoid burn-out - 30 straight minutes of PvP action can get exhausting if you do it every time its up) but I had a great time. Honestly, my only gripes about STV are that the beach spawn sucks giga-butt and that the lag drops the event from a 9/10 to like a nearly unplayable 2/10 during peak hours.
It doesn’t matter what your opinion is. The meta hivemind determines what you’re allowed to do. There are melee players offering gold to raids just for an opportunity to run with them. It’s only going to get worse.
This should get slightly less obnoxious with the nerf to boss armor… but only slightly.
Truth be told, I think that making melee hunter meta was just a huge, huge mistake. Especially in a tier where you “need” ranged players to push the buttons.
I know in my guild we had like four hunters who all went melee, suddenly we have almost zero ranged players - my mage, one guy’s warlock, and one of the lock tanks going DPS as needed across like 2.5 raids. It’s pretty sus. Hunters being the only meta ranged class and now it not being a ranged class means very few ranged mains exist.
100% agreed. PvP has almost unlimited replay potential. I am revered in WSG and I still go play for fun, I have my AGM and I still go to the arena during Bloodmoon (I leave after though because the lag is untenable). I don’t even care about the rewards, I just enjoy the chaos that is WoW PvP. I believe we need PvP modifiers on all weapons/items going forward built in, so the devs don’t have to make a broad sweeping ability/rune/talent/spell change which will inevitably impact PvE with no regard for PvP.
Same deal with BFD, run a few runs that don’t down theraplugg, get geared, clear thermaplugg on the regular. /dusthands
Sure the sweatjockeys and paint-by-number fridgepicture mefirsters will claim they are better but they are really just the ones that need the ego boost the most if you think about it.
That’s why they need so much validation and humblebrag that they are out of things to do or need tweaks to classes to make things juuust right, over squeezing the turnip.
Remember people don’t follow the unhappy people and expect to be happy.
Literally a skill issue
No content in classic or SoD requires optimized minmaxing to clear
When you actually do minmax and optimize dps in the way people seem to think is “required” all you are really doing is cheesing the encounters so hard you can ignore a majority of the mechanics and circumvent the way the encounter was designed to play out
Being top DPS does not matter. Being bottom DPS absolutely matters. I want a buff to frost spec. I don’t want them to be the top damage spec, I just want them to be middle of the pack. When I join my guilds raid signup and I have to say “Hey guys, is it ok if I play frost spec?” then it’s a problem. They don’t mind, it’s a guild after all. But good luck pugging with that.
Neat. Now how does your reply contribute to the topic at hand?
Those players need to be in a guild then. If guilds won’t take guildies with them then it’s time to find a new guild.
This goes both ways.
Because the point is people crying about being nerfed in pve is nothing more than babyrage at not being able to flex on meaningless dps epeen measuring contests on the class they’re playing
No class is “unviable”
The complaints about pvp related nerfs affecting PvE “viability” are purely emotional reactions
You can literally queue with any spec and get into a bg. You can literally assign zero talent points and hit Exalted. You’re drowning your own take by posing an argument that looks so much worse when turned around on PvP.
There is no competitive game mode in SoD to properly balance PvP. There is no arena. All there is are open world ganks and ranged classes killing you across the map in AB.