Can I just say how utterly stupid that is? How many deathless entities are there in WoW now? Just ends up cheapening the idea of it cause hey, this new guy may not be able to die, but neither could 18 of the past villains either
Honestoy the deal with Helya needs to die and stay dead. It was Legion content and rarely does Blizzard do anything to reference non current content.
Except when you realize that the ONLY role the entire Horde had throughout Legion was to set up this storyline. The ONLY zone we had relevance in (outside of Surumar with Liadrin) was with Nathanos and Sylvanas in Stormheim. There was no resolution to that story; no context given; no truths revealed. All we know is that they gutted Vol’jin to hamfist Sylvie into a chair she doesn’t fit, to what amounts to a strangely placed hurrah moment for Genn.
You really think, with ALL of that ambiguity and build-up, THIS expansion (THIS story) is not an extension of what Blizzard started with Helya in Stormheim? I mean, we know she’s alive, the Island Expeditions tell us that … why bother letting us know that if she didn’t have a role to play? Its the reason I rage-quit in Legion (rather than BfA) … I knew EXACTLY where Blizz was going with a Sylvie warchief after Stormheim (to a place that would not end well for the Red Team).
While I think Kael “merely a setback” Thas was a waste of a character, I did like the method they used for him in recycling a boss - he came back, but was clearly affected by it and had a different character.
I hope that they do something similar with future ‘undying’ bosses that the player has already hacked down to 0hp: even if they’re not dead dead, show the effect on their psyche so that their first ‘death’ feels like a form of character progression rather than future appearances being just character repetition.
Cause why should it? The rest of the zone quesus began and ended in those zones, the only difference being that 2 brought in the Nightborne and Highmountain to go beyond it. They were parts to the greater whole (getting the pillars) and that was all they were.
I get the Horde got jack in Legion besides a shiny new warchief, but very little of past expansions manages to become relevant in the current stuff, for either faction.
Because its the only thing that make her actions makes sense in this expansion.
And, as a rule, Sylvanas Windrunner is one of the few characters that has had a long lived-reoccuring plot thread throughout multiple expansion (even if it didn’t manifest in each game). Her current story arc began in “Edge of Night”. Its bluntly (and brutally) in the open in Cata. Teased within both MoP AND WoD (in small side content). It takes center stage again in Legion (her deal with Heyla, that was absolutely an extension of her “Edge of Night” motives) … so I expect her actions in BfA to also be STRONGLY tied to that narrative.
And, as a side note, Genn’s attack on Sylvanas in Legion is a DIRECT extension of the Gilneas intro questline in Cata. So much for story threads being concluded in their own expansions right?
I agree, one big difference between alliance and horde? They complain about not getting enough wins or looking incompetent, we complain about our non-existent story. Like there is really nothing to look forward to in the horde story, oh look were gonna have to redeem ourselves again?
But in reality, the power balance is massively in favor of the alliance, a roster full of super champions, more man power, and a leg up in technology. So blizzard has to write them incompetent for the horde to even stand a chance (Even WoT the horde just barley beat the night elves outnumbering them 8:1).
Where as the horde hasent really had a (major) character developed since when? Garrosh or vol’jin? Only just in bfa were developing more characters.
Plus on top of that I feel like there have been an odd amount of horde shaming threads (and posts) recently. Like its fun to get caught up in the story and all, but end of the day its a game and were just all players tryin to have some fun.
Yeah … I’ll admit the frustration in my posts have increased due in no small part to the unusual Horde Shame threads popping up more and more lately (due in no small part to a particularly vitriolic draenei). Its exhausting … and where at one point I was VERY on the side of at least the NEs getting as much as they can out of the conclusion of BfA (short of wiping out too many of our brutalized roster) … I just don’t care as much as I used to.
Its gotten to the point where “Mostly” Faction Exclusive Continents is actually starting to sound appealing. I used to be pretty against that concept at one point … But after being told I should be ashamed of picking the wrong faction 15 years ago (and the themes that the WC3 Horde held dear), perhaps I can’t be bothered to care about a playerbase that apparently picked the wrong PC race from that same era (if they ever didn’t just want to get beat up).
Saurfang sent an army through the mountains through a smuggling route, crossing those mountains was considered impossible.
“but flying mounts…”
yea i know but blizzard seems to forget those exist until they need them. for example, why couldnt the horde just fly around the wall O wisps?
Unfortunately after the Burning of Teldrassil I think a mutually positive ending is 100% impossible.
I said ZONE threads Droite. they’d be mad to have no purely story related threads to tie everything together. That is what Helya amounted to; A zone quest. Her and Sylvanas made a deal, it was a thing, and that was it. If past zone quests were so integral to BfA, the Court of Faradonis would have come to the Alliance in Nazjatar.
Yea it dosent really bother me its just… odd to see,
Iv said it before and ill say it again,
They messed up with the story this expansion,
You cant give the horde enough redemption.
You cant give the alliance enough justice/vengeance without totally trashing one faction or another.
So its like… where do we even go from here?
I think this point is missed often. It makes an ending with parity seem awful because one side is in the Space Age and the other side is in the Stone Age.
The Zandalari Fleet appears to be largely armed with huge Scorpion like crossbow thingies that fire flaming bolts?
The Kul Tirans have Galleons with cannons - and one that flies!
The Alliance has the space traveling/inter-dimensional Vindicaar.
The Horde has… Gallywix’s stationary canon atop his pleasure palace?
The Alliance has Tyrande, Malfurion, Alleria, Jaina, Anduin - Characters with near demigod power levels.
The Horde only has Sylvanas.
Nathanos did hold off Tyrande and Malfurion with the help of Valkyr - but those Valkyr are bound to Sylvanas. They sacrifice themselves to give her existence. It is basically an extension of her power. She can’t be everywhere.
And that is just the glaring stuff.
An ending with parity or any semblance of equity would be hard to pull off when BfA started so lopsided.
It is funny but i used to see even crazier people than her around they used to have even higher demands for teld.
Really i think a hood portion of horde hate would die down if blizz on screen and through perhaps a compersed scenario unlocked over a month showed a despreate hodre struggle that ended in the allince killing s bunch of civilians on screen with no if ands or buts about it. Also this huge loss becomes something that devastates the npc. It dosent have to destroy a city or kill anyone big just make an impact far greater than UC did .
And now you’re just being super arbitrary. The Court of Farondis originated in Azsuna; therefore their story began and ended in that zone. Sylvanas however did NOT originate from Stormheim, so there is no such rule dictating that her story with Heyla need in end in it. Besides, the conflict with Heyla OUTSIDE of that Sylvanas content, was exclusively fixated on Odyn (not Sylvanas). The only story that saw resolution was HIS story with the Queen of the Dead, not Sylvie’s.
I really wish blizz would bring in the ship… then again i wish blizz would estsblish that the entire gard army of the light had more than one damned ship.
Eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind. Plus blizzard would never tarnish the alliance like that, they already white wash anything bad the alliance does (purge, vulpera, orcs past with humans).
If so then what does the alliance give up? Because as far as i see the horde and alliance are generally the same when to comes to military victories this expansion, with the alliance maybe even being slightly ahead.
Faction exclusive continents I suppose … and breaking both sides to the point where they can’t exercise authority over the other. As awful as that solution is, it would certain get us out of eachother’s ways and create the impetus for a whole lot more INTERNAL Faction narratives (rather than external ones). The Horde would have a chance to finally coalesce, the Alliance would finally have a chance at internal strife.
There are stories with that route … just the costs to achieving them would be catastrophically huge (especially for two specific races).
Thing is without some loss that is drawn out and hammered in it will never actully feel like the horde loses in the same way. They lose in a neboulus off screen way. Also i am not talking military victories i am talking an emotional impact. Teld desipte barely being a victory on paper feels a lot more impactful than UC which was almost a steam roll.
Its kinda weird your asking for even more emotional impact on the horde, our narrative has already been wrecked…
Trust me the story this expansion has been just as if not more unpleasant for us than it has been for you…
You also mention off screen… more white washing again!!!
You want that sweet victory, but dont wanna get your hands dirty for it.
Arbitrary? The Court was cursed by Azshara to be ghost people, and their leader stood up to her. They are still in Azsuna, still cursed, and haven’t made a peep since Legion. If you so dearly wanted a Zone storyline in Legion to make its way into BfA, then you would have to accept them as well.