Multiboxing Clarification

[Zkut-thrall]

I am hoping to get some clarification. I just learned about the newest updates to the multi-boxing bans. I’m hoping I’m wrong, but it sounds like Blizzard wants us to pay for multiple subscriptions, but won’t let us do anything so we can actually USE THEM concurrently, even if we’re running a “normal” PC and “normal” keyboard for each account we’re logged into.

Does this ban actually include the use of addons that call on sanctioned API provided by Blizzard? I’m talking addons on CurseForge, like EMA and MAMA, and DynamicBoxer, that together help invite your other toons to the group; with quest sharing; help with following; help with mounting (when it works); and choosing the same flight path (again, when it works)? I’m talking ZERO auto/multi-broadcast targeting, gathering, looting, spell-casting or movement (beyond following).

[Tolna-veknilash]

To give you a short answer:

Blizzard isn’t going to give a detail list of what is and isn’t allowed in the area - they keep it vague on purpose.

[Nok-winterhoof (Nok)]

Blizzard has always claimed multi-boxing is allowed but not supported.

The “not supported” part of that statement means if some multi-boxing ability is broken by something implemented to deal with another issue, tey will not necessarily implement a fix for multi-boxing.
You effectively use it at your own risk.

[Kalviery]

The only information we’re able to provide is what was publicly announced earlier in May:

Policy Update for Input Broadcasting - May 2021

On November 3, 2020, we posted an update to our policy for input broadcasting software, and soon thereafter, we began taking action against accounts found to be using third party software to automatically mirror keystrokes to multiple game clients. We find that, like full automation of play, multiple-account mirroring disturbs the gameplay experience for the vast majority of players who control a single account at a time. We will now additionally prohibit the use of all software and hardware me…

[Mastadôn-thrall (Mastadôn)]

Anything that helps streamline MB is now punishable. It is up to you to interpret that how you will. I wish I could give you a clear cut answer to your questions, I’m sorry I cannot.

The only clear cut answer I can give you it to manually change game windows via alt tab or windowed mode and click on each and everything manually, game instance by game instance.

[Dingringding-zuljin]

I wouldn’t use the addons just to be safe. Make an ingame macro for inviting (or add your toona to fl and hit tab when inviting) pick up questie for classic and for retail I suggest just keeping track. Flight paths just manually click on each flight path. Follow make a /follow name macro ingame to do that with. Do not use keyboard or mouse based macros through your devices hardware even for a single window. If you have a button on your keyboard that alt tabs when you push it that is a no go. You must push alt then tab manually. Same with any other keys with modifiers.

[Zkut-thrall]

This will sound rude, so I apologize, but can’t you try to find out? Clearly I’ve already read that, to have questions and concerns. And since I have them, it clearly wasn’t helpful.

The consequences, of being found to have infringed, are catastrophic. And I’m supposed to GUESS???

How can a company pretend to provide “customer service”, when you never have (and won’t try to get) answers? It’s fine not to know. Having worked in a number of customer service-related jobs, however, the correct answer was, “We don’t know, but we can try to find out.” I’m just asking you to please TRY. The devs wrote the awful policy, so they should know what it’s supposed to mean. Don’t you work for the same company? Have corporate email?

Effectively telling a long-term paying customer to go pound sand, over something that could FOREVER take away a product they’ve spent thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours on, over 15+ years, is just insane.

As it stands, the current policy is open to infinitely broad interpretation. Literally anything that isn’t virgin wow could be a trigger for a ban, depending on the GM’s or Dev’s whim.

If I did get banned, I wouldn’t even get an explanation beyond “you did a bad thing,” no one would detail precisely WHAT was the thing I did wrong, and they would be unlikely to examine whether they made a mistake or if justice was actually served.

Honestly, your company is incredibly depressing to deal with. No one cares. AT ALL.

[Tolna-veknilash]

@Zkut-thrall

This will sound rude, so I apologize, but can’t you try to find out? Clearly I’ve already read that, to have questions and concerns. And since I have them, it clearly wasn’t helpful.

No, the blues here can’t find out - their job isn’t to give details on something the devs left vague, as I said, on purpose. They don’t want folks to play rules lawyer with them, it isn’t something they want folks to get a green light on something and the maker change it that broke the rules in the next five minutes.

@Zkut-thrall

How can a company pretend to provide “customer service”, when you never have (and won’t try to get) answers? It’s fine not to know. Having worked in a number of customer service-related jobs, however, the correct answer was, “We don’t know, but we can try to find out.”

Sometimes the answer is being tit lip, keep it behind close doors and go against the rules of the company. This isn’t trying to find an item at another store, this is a rule that Blizzard has that they wish to keep close to the vest.

@Zkut-thrall

I’m just asking you to please TRY. The devs wrote the awful policy, so they should know what it’s supposed to mean. Don’t you work for the same company? Have corporate email?

To put it bluntly; if they wanted to do such, they’d have done such in the thread that was posted by the blue in General. No, asking up the chain isn’t going to change or give the answer because a Blizzard worker asked.

@Zkut-thrall

As it stands, the current policy is open to infinitely broad interpretation.

To be freak on this; that’s what they want when they made that ruling - to have the favor in their court. Not really have to worry about if X was fine today, but change to Y tomorrow, what should they do? This is why blizzard give support to add-ons - if something wrong with it, they’re not be able to fix or help with it.

@Zkut-thrall

If I did get banned, I wouldn’t even get an explanation beyond “you did a bad thing,” no one would detail precisely WHAT was the thing I did wrong, and they would be unlikely to examine whether they made a mistake or if justice was actually served.

This isn’t a court of law, there ain’t lawyers or a judge to over see cases. It just the team whom handle appeals looking over their internal logs about the account action. It isn’t a means to plea one’s case.

[Zkut-thrall]

This policy doesn’t just hurt multiboxers, it hurts disabled people, of which I am one. Which people have already pointed out.

Not that Blizzard cares.

[Perl-anetheron (Perl)]

@Zkut-thrall

but can’t you try to find out?

The answer is that the policy was clearly meant to be vague. I agree, it could certainly be more clear, but the Blues here are not in a position to provide further details. If Blizzard wanted it to be more detailed, they’d have written it that way.

At the end of the day, Multiboxing has never been supported by Blizzard. It’s not something that they’re going to be able to help you out with or clarify beyond the currently available policy.

Personally, the way that I read it, I wouldn’t use any addon, software or hardware of any kind to make multiboxing easier. I would absolutely stick with alt-tabbing. Even if there’s an addon that can help out, I’d steer clear just based on the current policy.

@Zkut-thrall

This policy doesn’t just hurt multiboxers, it hurts disabled people, of which I am one. Which people have already pointed out.

o.O Not sure what a multiboxing policy has to do with being disabled. There’s actually an email address with Blizz for contacting them if you feel an accessibility issue has become a barrier. You can find more details here:

Accessibility at Blizzard Entertainment

[Kalviery]

Large changes to policy, like those announced in November and then again updated in May go through a very long involved process. These messages must go through the development team, the legal team, and of course PR.

So what has been conveyed publicly is what was decided after much consideration and discussion. And it is not something I, nor anyone else in the Customer Support department can elaborate on further.

If you would like to share feedback, you may do so in the General Discussion forum. The Customer Support forum is not an avenue to provide feedback.

If you feel there is an issue with Accessibility inside Blizzard games, we offer a direct avenue to provide that feedback as well:

Accessibility at Blizzard Entertainment

Edit: Looks like Perl beat me to the linking!

[Mastadôn-thrall (Mastadôn)]

@Zkut-thrall

Not that Blizzard cares.

On the contrary. They care very much.

However, they care about what some of this software is capable of doing and the integrity of the game as well. Unfortunately boxers are collateral damage of botters

Due to this new policy the two largest public bot developers have taken their programs down. It has had an IMMEDIATE effect on the problem.

If you want to be angry about these changes, blame the cheaters. They did this to legit boxers.

[Rufflebottom-bloodhoof (Rufflebottom)]

@Zkut-thrall

How can a company pretend to provide “customer service”, when you never have (and won’t try to get) answers? It’s fine not to know. Having worked in a number of customer service-related jobs, however, the correct answer was, “We don’t know, but we can try to find out.” I’m just asking you to please TRY. The devs wrote the awful policy, so they should know what it’s supposed to mean. Don’t you work for the same company? Have corporate email?

Mutli-boxing has never been supported by Blizzard. That means that Blizzard will not help you with it.

You were provided with all the information that Customer Support is able to provide.

SFAs are not able to “try and find out”. That is not their job. They are not liaisons with the Devs.

Having corporate email doesn’t matter. There is a proper protocol for in-house communication.

If you want to ask the Devs, try their Twitter account at @WarcraftDevs.

@Zkut-thrall

As it stands, the current policy is open to infinitely broad interpretation. Literally anything that isn’t virgin wow could be a trigger for a ban, depending on the GM’s or Dev’s whim.

GMs have to follow protocol. Nothing is done on their “whim”.
Most major policy changes about multi-boxing were announced before the changes were implemented. Account action was not applied to accounts that used the problem software before the announcement. There was a short period of time when warnings were given instead of account action.

@Zkut-thrall

no one would detail precisely WHAT was the thing I did wrong

Correct. Blizzard is not required to give a detailed report on what they found.

@Zkut-thrall

they would be unlikely to examine whether they made a mistake or if justice was actually served.

Interesting that you claim this when a recent issue with the algorithm being used to identify problem accounts caused action on some unintended accounts. They were all overturned on appeal.

Appeals just get someone else to look at the data and confirm the decision and action taken. They are not to plead your case.

@Zkut-thrall

Honestly, your company is incredibly depressing to deal with. No one cares. AT ALL.

Sometimes the answer is “no”. It doesn’t mean no one cares.

[Kitten-anvilmar]

@Policy Update for Input Broadcasting - May 2021

we began taking action against accounts found to be using third party software to automatically mirror keystrokes to multiple game clients. We find that, like full automation of play, multiple-account mirroring disturbs the gameplay experience for the vast majority of players who control a single account at a time. We will now additionally prohibit the use of all software and hardware me…

This doesn’t seem that vague to me. It sounds pretty clear.

@Policy Update for Input Broadcasting - May 2021

using third party software to automatically mirror keystrokes to multiple game clients

Don’t do that.

idk what those specific addons do but…

@Zkut-thrall

that together help invite your other toons to the group; with quest sharing; help with following; help with mounting (when it works); and choosing the same flight path

As long as those addons are done with no automation and not across accounts.

You say they don’t have any auto/multi-targeting for targeting, gathering, looting, spell-casting, or movement… but its not just those issues its no auto/mullt-broadcast for anything.

You need to switch between accounts and actually clicky.

[Idontknowhow-darrowmere]

@Zkut-thrall

but won’t let us do anything so we can actually USE THEM concurrently,

You cannot use any hardware or software that provides simultaneous access to multiple windows at once.

@Zkut-thrall

like EMA and MAMA, and DynamicBoxer, that together help invite your other toons to the group; with quest sharing; help with following; help with mounting (when it works); and choosing the same flight path (again, when it works)? I’m talking ZERO auto/multi-broadcast targeting, gathering, looting, spell-casting or movement (beyond following).

Blizzard won’t give specifics because, as multiboxing is an unsupported activity, they aren’t going to go out of their way to make sure that players participating is unsupported gameplay are sufficiently equipped to do so within the confines of the rules. The general rule is that anything that streamlines multiboxing (makes doing it faster) or copies keystrokes (control multiple windows at once) is against the rules.

@Zkut-thrall

but can’t you try to find out?

@Zkut-thrall

How can a company pretend to provide “customer service”, when you never have (and won’t try to get) answers?

@Zkut-thrall

Effectively telling a long-term paying customer to go pound sand, over something that could FOREVER take away a product they’ve spent thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours on, over 15+ years, is just insane.

That’s not Blizzard’s job. “Unsupported” means it is allowed, but you get zero support from Blizzard regarding information or protection from account sanctions. And multiboxing has been unsupported since word GO, so there is no excuse for confusion there.

@Zkut-thrall

If I did get banned, I wouldn’t even get an explanation beyond “you did a bad thing,” no one would detail precisely WHAT was the thing I did wrong,

They tell you categorically what you did wrong. They’re not going to give specifics because that would give cheaters the information they need to bypass detection systems by altering their behavior and programs accordingly.

@Zkut-thrall

Literally anything that isn’t virgin wow could be a trigger for a ban

… Yes. That’s how most popular game titles operate. You get caught modding Call of Duty, you can sacked. You use the ranked point exploit in Apex Legends to queue into lower lobbies whereas that clearly was not intended, you get banned. You get caught cheating in Rainbow Six Siege, you get banned immediately. The whole concept of “cheating” is that a player uses or modifies the game to gain an advantage that the original game content doesn’t provide, so you’re lucky that you’re even allowed to multibox to begin with.

[Roxxia-fairbanks]

You might say the rules are vague but I feel like they are quite clear. The policy is in place to stop people from multiboxing. If you press one button and that makes all 5 or 20 of your characters hit a monster or another player, that’s not okay.

This wasn’t just a developer decision. It was the will of the entire community, minus the <1% of players who multibox.

So stop trying to fish for a loophole in an attempt to save you from a ban because just like bots, nobody wants multiboxers.

[Mastadôn-thrall (Mastadôn)]

@Roxxia-fairbanks

This wasn’t just a developer decision. It was the will of the entire community, minus the <1% of players who multibox.

Please don’t paint in broad strokes like that. I am not a boxer, I have never boxed, I have exactly zero interest in it. However, it also has never bothered me at all. If that is how people want to play, so be it, who am I to tell them otherwise, so long as it is within the rules.

Further, it is actually a factually false statement. The change, as I said above, was handicap botting. Boxers are just unfortunate casualties in the war against bots.

Also as previously stated, this single change caused the two largest public botting software makers to pull their product from market.

Boxing may be unpopular with a statistically insignificant portion of the WoW population, it may be unpopular with 20% of them, or I may be the statistical anomaly. However stating it was the will of the entire community is simply…wrong.

[Kalviery]

I know Multiboxing is a very weighted topic and folks have some strong opinions. I think this topic has covered what can be covered though, so we’ll go ahead and lock it up.

Thanks everyone