Yeah that’s pretty fair. Either that or reduce their damage by 50% while bubbled. Bubble should be a last resort. Not CheatEngine to do your PvE burst rotation.
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Is a ret paladin complaining about other classes having training wheels?
That was kind of the essence of the joke. But, it did happen.
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Sure, and let me kick a warrior mid-Bladestorm. Since we are removing the spell requirements of kicks now it’s only fair.
Kicked or not, the abilities being kickable isn’t the issue. You can’t kick me when i’m 80 yards away nuking you out of existence.
PLUS, you can still stun the hunter while they’re casting aimed shot or rapid fire.
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Because the Hunter had the Ancient Artifact in Ashran.
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Hey look, another melee SV supporter demanding egregious nerfs to their own class just like the other thread.
In BFA we had Sniper Shot, the increased range, and uninterruptable shots. However it did significantly less damage and had less available utility.
The result was that it was by far the worst DPS spec in all of PvP.
You were still there demanding nerfs to it, though.
He’s a Survival fan. They are generally hostile to Hunter class interests. After all, the driving philosophy of that spec was to appeal to players other than Hunter players, so it’s no surprise that it invited a bunch of people to the class that are openly hostile towards Hunter class interests.
To back this up, there are currently 742 Ret paladins above 2100 rating compared to 459 MM Hunters.
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In BFA hardly anyone chose it. I didn’t start seeing it being used regularly until later in SL. Also BFA BM was 
Really adds an extra layer to the whole “You’ve gotten so used to playing the game on training wheels that you can’t even see that you would still be in better shape than every other ranged spec should you get kicked with this set up.”
Actually, current day survival plays a good bit like an old school vanilla hunter invested into the survival part of the talent tree. They had an in and out style of doing both ranged and melee damage. That went away for awhile and then came back for the current version of survival.
How exactly does Sniper shot do 900k damage? the ability literally does 20% of enemy hp. How would that ever equal 900k? The ability doesn’t do that, at all.
Nonsense statement. Survival in classic WoW preferred to stay at range as much as possible. Especially in PvE where any melee class would destroy you if you spent extended time up close. If you could spend 100% of the time at range, you would. The melee abilities were for when you couldn’t.
The only real exception was if you were fighting someone who was keyboard turning so they literally couldn’t keep facing you as you jumped around them (the subject of approximately 100% of “omg classic melee hunter!” montages), but such a player would likely be even more thoroughly destroyed with ranged abilities.
The idea that classic Hunter, a ranged weapon user, is precedent for modern SV, a spec without a ranged weapon, is one of the greatest myths of class design.
It’s 20% base damage but it gets increased my modifiers e.g. Mastery and it can crit. For 900k damage however you need an especially large modifier like the Ancient Artifact in Ashran. I’ve hit for over a million with it there.
Wasn’t it also a trap specialist?
You could not use traps in combat in Classic so trap usage was situational. Usually the best usage of traps was, when caught in melee, you could feign death into a Frost Trap and as Survival that would have a chance of snaring them in addition to the slow and allow you to escape back to range. You could also, of course, pre-place traps at important objectives like WSG flags. This was true for all the specs but Survival, in addition to the Entrapment snare, had more powerful trap effects on shorter cooldowns.
There were damaging traps, Immolation Trap and Explosive Trap, however they scaled with spell damage instead of attack power (because classic Hunter design was nonsense) so the damage didn’t scale well and they were not very useful in most situations. They (more specifically Explosive Trap) were more useful in TBC when they a) could be used in combat and b) scaled with attack power, albeit not very well. The peak involvement of traps was WotLK where Explosive Trap was extremely powerful especially as Survival, and it tied into the Lock and Load proc system which was a key part of Survival damage output.
So in other words, yes lol.
I guess but your post made it seem like you were contending the part where I said it preferred to stay at range. That part is still true with or without the trapping.
Nah, it was just something sitting in my vague memory about old school survs and traps.
Fun fact: Dragonflight is the lowest point of SV-specific trap bonuses the spec has ever seen.
- Classic->WoD: Reduced trap cooldowns, enhanced effects, Entrapment root effect to some traps
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- WotLK->WoD also had Lock and Load which was free uses of Explosive Shot, it’s signature ability, proccing from traps
- Legion: All traps were Survival-only for the first 6 months (one of the worst Hunter design decisions of all time before making it melee in the first place, btw), Waylay passive giving traps enhanced effects if they weren’t triggered for a few secs after placing, Entrapment root effect (IIRC?), Diamond Ice PvP talent
- BFA->SL: Exclusive Steel Trap talent, Diamond Ice PvP talent
- Dragonflight: Diamond Ice PvP talent
So there are now no SV-specific trap bonuses in PvE, and only a minor talent for PvP. SV’s identity as the trapper spec is long gone.
P.S. The reduced trap cooldowns and Entrapment root effects were re-introduced in our class tree but they are no longer specific to Survival.
Yes, it was a trap specialist with some very significant defensives that could actually allow you to go toe to toe with any melee. It was very effective at in-and-out gameplay with a natural counter to the “dead zone” which was clocking you over the head with raptor strike.
This was back when hunters could use ranged and melee weapons. I have a couple of old TBC movies playing it just to prove that I’m right about this.
Deterrence and aspect of the monkey gave huge amounts of dodge and parry.
Open video
Warrior keyboard turns immediately
Close video
P.S. If Hunters could effectively counter other melee by fighting in melee range in BC, without egregious skill gaps like this, it would be one of the most broken specs of the day since it would have no counter. Yet it was the least-represented spec of the least-represented class in rated PvP. I wonder why that was.
There are literally some high rated warriors in these videos. 
And, the playstyle is the issue here. In and out with melee and ranged attacks. Deterrance and aspect of the monkey gave some obscene levels of parry and dodge, up to 40-60%.
You are wrong. Again.
Because I was the only person doing this probably. I’m in season one gear here fighting people in season two gear with shoulders and weapon in some clips. Do you know what that even means?
The design was OBVIOUSLY there to mix range and melee damage, while controlling people with traps and wingclip. This is why it had deterrence and aspect of the monkey and a melee weapon. It had better toe to toe defensives then than survival currently has now.
It’s not my fault that most people weren’t playing it correctly.