Should remove double tap and stop nerfing Aimed Shot every time prepatch goes live.
8 Likes
imo both double tap and rapid fire need to be removed and replaced, and the talent tree design needs jesus.
9 Likes
I did a Venthyr Marks kill shot build and I don’t run out of things to press and kill shot lots. Did more damage on the dummies compared to Night Fae.
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You can go read what the DF set bonuses are, not sit and wish they’ll fix the problem.
They won’t, FYI.
All the DF sets are tame and one thing people really need to get hammered into their brains is that we just had 4-6+ years of borrowed power, every xpac, every patch, every class, every spec. You’ve been swimming in borrowed power if you’ve played steadily for the last few years. That era is over. It’s a big selling point of DF, that borrowed power is gone.
Your talent trees are it. If you don’t like how your class/spec plays or feels with your talent trees, there’s no sitting and hoping they’ll patch it. They won’t.
They just got done with the redesign phase of classes, and they aren’t going to do it again until DF is ending, that’s 2+ years.
MM has big issues. It’s in contention for the absolute worst spec in the game and that’s WITH the borrowed power of SL. Once you step out of SL, it’ll get worse, not better. There are no systems in DF to boost your power level or smooth out your mechanics, THAT’S WHAT THE TALENT SYSTEM IS FOR!
Wait and see time is over. What you have right now is what you’re getting (+5 talent points, for what that’s worth). That’s it.
MM isn’t the only class/spec with issues but it’s a case study in what DF is like. Here are your talents, now go collect stat sticks and grind out raids/m+ for 2 years. For some specs, that’s great, they’re in a good spot, and there is enough diversity to keep players interested and playing for the duration of the expansion. Having said that, DF is still half baked garbage shoveled out the door in time for Christmas, it’s not finished and it never will be. Part of that is that roughly half the specs are still in the dumpster.
They didn’t qualitatively or quantitatively change a damn thing about how they communicate with players and they sure as hell didn’t listen to anything, except the dollars that up and left. That’s why MM talents got shuffled around for 3 months in alpha and then it’s been radio silence since. They don’t listen, they don’t care, they haven’t changed and if you care about any of those things, DF is just the typical sucker play to bring back subs with shiny bulls**t. All the fundamental problems are still front and center.
7 Likes
[What Hunter could be]
imgur . com/a/RaLSy5C (remove the space before and after the [.])
Gonna leave this here I’m not saying you have to make all those 2-point talents 1-point but if we could just get two-thirds of them changed in MM, BM, and the Surv tree so we are more in-line with the Warlock, Warrior, and Monk trees it might feel like we aren’t losing so much going into DF and maybe it will feel like we are actually gaining power. That link is obviously a single target tree but having a few extra points means we can build a 2 or 3 target cleave build as well and a Mythic+ build where it doesn’t feel like we are losing all of our single target as well
Waiting on riot mmo, all I can do is pray now. I’ve lost faith in blizz since wod, legion was a (good) anomaly. In hindsight bfa and sl make wod look like a good xpac. Imagine going from stat templets where you can easily patch in buffs or nerfs, to implementing set bonuses on gear for balance issues. From a business standpoint it makes sense (so they can sell as many tokens as possible) but in practice and what’s actually healthy for the game, just a terrible idea. I would like to state that I don’t think every person on the forums is looking to voice their opinions to blizzard employees, I’m sure some just enjoy conversing with other people about this game we’re all so passionate about. Appreciate some of the insight on this whole borrowed power(or lack thereof) concept.
2 Likes
It took a little playing around but I finally settled on this build as Venthyr:
Basically it leans into Rapid fire heavily. It has solid AOE damage and quite strong single target. It lacks 2T cleave power but it’s not completely useless there, but that’s to be expected.
If you put the URL in a code block you do not need to insert spaces and such
EG
https://imgur.com/a/RaLSy5C
1 Like
Even in PvP MM Hunters were only performing well in RANDOM battlegrounds. They had some of the least representation in all forms of rated content.
Please just remove Double Tap. I’m really feeling that nerf to Aimed shot considering the damage can now be healed in an instant cast low mana heal.
3 Likes
The thing is, damage on a +15 doesnt matter… Damage on low keys is heavily skewed to favor specs with high burst. The issue for MM comes in when you have mobs that live for extended periods of time and you’re stuck casting Steady Shot on 8+ mobs to generate focus while other specs like Fire mage are hardcasting a flamestrike followed by flame patch. MM currently has 0 sustained AoE damage, while also being capped at 6 targets. In higher keys in its current state, it will not do well and will not be played.
2 Likes
Rotation feels better I run NE but have been avoiding using NE abilities since I didn’t talent into it. Been running lfr for run I use to top DPS with 15 to 18k depending on the fight. Now I am around 9 to 13k. DPS lost for sure but no NE ABILITES which is a huge DPS lost. But it feels more fun to play.
While I agree that high keys will not have MM representation, I would argue that MM Hunters have been largely absent from 20+ for the majority of the expansion regardless of nerfs or the new talent tree. This is even with season 4’s tier set plus legendary interaction.
The brief experiment, while anecdotal, was a comparison of like for like on a personal level. The damage reduction to AiS is felt at all levels. MM Hunters have been adaptive in the past, but the overall perception this causes especially at high level gameplay cascades throughout all levels due to the prevalence of the many adopting the meta class mindset.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Blizzard changes Double Tap for all players, for the sake of PvP, to be a terrible version of itself and not compensate with an all-around damage buff.
1 Like
I think the spec was just poorly designed once it changed in BFA. The Legion iteration was perfect imo. It had good single target, good aoe, consistent damage, cool aesthetics, was fun and had a level of skill expression within the vulnerable window. I will never understand what made them change it.
I dont think it’s possible for this BFA/SL and now DF version of MM to ever do well in high keys. Not having an AoE resource generator is horrible, the spec also lacks in sustained damage in both ST and AOE while also having the worst cooldown in Trueshot. There’s definitely places where it does shine, an encounter that comes to mind is SotFO’s Xymox, and like I mentioned earlier, in lower keys, but outside of MMs burst the spec is just missing something.
Steady Shot generates 10 focus per cast while Multishot costs 20 and Aimed Shot costs 35. Even with your low passive focus regen, you still need to cast multiple Steady Shots to be able to get an Aimed Shot off, assuming you don’t have Rapid Fire available (which let’s be honest, is not any better at 7 focus over 1.6 seconds currently for me).
Overall, it’s just sad that a spec can be so limited while also being ignored.
6 Likes
That used to be the case, but in its current state, this is straight up wrong.
The amount of damage just doesn’t compare to other classes, DKs and Monks and Locks come to mind. If they’re going to nerf us to the ground, then give us some damn health regen so we can stay in the fight.
And wow, how sad does that sound.
The hunter has become the hunted.
1 Like
Right now Marksman just feels bad, aimed shot which is supposed to be our top ability does as much damage as a arcane shot which is just dumb. With full Heroic gear and the legendary bow i’m having aimed shots hitting None elite targets for 8k damage which should not EVER be. Something is seriously wrong with Marksman right now and their nerfs to the damage where not needed, because the tooltip saying it does 11k+ is completely wrong.
1 Like
Even Necro Marks in S3 and most of S4 wasn’t bad. I never played Legion so I can’t compare to that build but it wasn’t terrible. Now its so bad that you might as well just afk and let auto shots do your damage.
Why are you even in this thread?
3 Likes
While I hope they fix all this garbage, I can’t help but giggle a bit when I think back to so many MM Hunters telling BM Hunters to “deal with it” back when Shadowlands launched. You know, when BM was so far behind it took multiple 5% buffs to even get them close to the next worst spec.
1 Like
what
i need more info
The quick shot talent for survival didn’t work (I don’t believe it was fixed) if you had a certain weapon transmog. There was a thread here and quite a bit of discussion in the hunter discord about how it worked, but a staff mogged to look like a polearm simply wouldn’t proc it, anything mogged to the legion artifact would proc it, and axes never worked equipped or mogged.
This is just off the top of my head and the specifics may be incorrect, but this was the gist of it.
how on earth does this mess up this bad
1 Like