One of the few frustrating aspects of DH at least to me is the lack of any baseline snare ability.
Yes Vengeful Retreat technically snares, but not only does it take you AWAY from your target, it only lasts a scant 3 seconds of which you’ll really only have 2 just in getting back into melee range. And not to put too fine a point on it, but I prefer to actually use the ability for its intended purpose: retreat.
Normally this isn’t THAT big a deal because DH have other means of closing distances quickly, but it also makes dismounting ground mounted players nigh impossible unless you use the Master of the Glaive talent.
Which brings me to the point of the subject matter…why isn’t this ability baseline?
Versus the other two far more powerful CC talents in that tier, Master of the Glaive feels far too weak to be a realistic talent choice but at the same time is important enough to a melee play style to warrant serious consideration as a baseline mechanic to the Havoc spec.
And let’s be realistic, adding one extra weak damage glaive charge that can realistically snare opponents would hardly be game breaking.
We just can’t use the Net-o-Matic on ground mounts and while we can stun our opponents for long enough to do some reasonable damage to them, we cannot do it quickly enough to force a dismount.
This is especially frustrating in BGs where there are only ground mounts and there is nothing I can do to prevent an enemy player from just riding past me if they want to ignore me.
Please give some consideration to just making this talent baseline. It’s just not powerful enough to realistically be a talent and is simple enough damage and utility wise to not be game breaking or unbalance the Havoc spec.
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What would take its place?
(Devil’s Advocate, I actually agree with this.)
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Even though this is only for havoc right now, I would argue that this should also be baseline for veng. It really sucks not having a reliable slow. Even if the slow was at reduced effectiveness, it would be better than nothing.
It’s frustrating in siege where I can’t slow the 2nd boss and the rest of the group doesn’t understand that I can’t apply a slow to stop the boss from running away. No other tank needs to worry about that except guardian, unless they can root while in bear form now.
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you could replace it with anything tbh nothing will never be better than fel eruption (pvp wise).
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One idea I had for a potential replacement talent would be what I’m calling Baleful Gaze .
Baleful Gaze : Any targets hit by your Eye Beam are now disoriented for 2 seconds.
I figure since Eye Beam is a key part of our rotation that it would benefit from a disorient ability since it can be very annoying when it’s interrupted. This way you would have a more guaranteed chance to cast a full duration Eye Beam while creating a little bit of havoc in the process if you’re positioned right and there is more than one enemy nearby.
And I figure with a 2 sec disorient it won’t represent a game breaking level of CC. It would be less about hard controlling enemies and more about making sure your Eye Beams reach full duration more often so the damage isn’t wasted. And if used at the right moment it could still ruin someone’s day.
What do you guys think? And if you have any suggestions of your own I’d love to hear them!
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How about a talent that makes Eye Beam explode for half it’s remaining damage in a 5 yard aoe when interrupted?
I’m not sure I want a button that starts DR for a 2 sec disorient.
Another idea was Backlash.
Backlash: When Eye Beam is interrupted, fel energy explodes from the Demon Hunter and disorients all enemies in a 5 yard radius for 3-4 seconds.
Alternately, enemies could be actively punished for interrupting your key ability and provide the DH with a nasty surprise. This would be pretty much strictly PvP only.
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Just throw a version of demon reborn back in the slot and give throw glaive snare with two charges to both specs baseline.
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My idea was to bring bloodlet back and take away trail of ruin. Bake in a slow from bloodlet (you’re Achilles got glaived bruh)
Now you have another ability to track, takes away baked in garbage talent from trail of ruin. Allows use of fel barrage.
Replace old trail of ruin talent with a two charge version or a buff talent to bloodlet.
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I agree they say because we are very mobile we can’t have a snare… look at monks they are almost as mobile if not more than us and they have a snare/root ability, druids too have root and snare so this is insulting…
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Yes for the love of god, why are we the only DPS class without a baseline snare/slow? These devs man, it’s like they don’t play their own game.
I agree, Monks have more mobility than we do as do Druids, and both their melee DPS specs have baseline snares.
So mobility is not a good enough excuse, especially considering Master of the Glaive is significantly weaker than the other CC talents in the same tier.
It unfairly penalizes Havoc in particular because if we want to stop a mounted player from just riding right past us, we have to give up significant hard CC when no other melee DPS spec has to.
Heck, even Retribution Paladins have a good baseline snare now. So why shouldn’t Havoc have one as well?
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Actually I thought this for Vengeance PvP instead so it could have some decent peel ability. Also, bringing back the bleed ability wouldn’t hurt either.
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God I miss bloodlet so much.
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Classes that have a baseline slow don’t get a snare as well.
Agree. Pretty sure DHs are the only melees in the game with no baseline snare. Even Rets get a snare now.
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Agree with this, no reason MotG should be a talent, every class BUT the DH has a slow.
Completely agree and I’ll tack on Felblade as well being baseline. Maybe that’s too greedy but the snare is an important part of the toolkit.
I hate vengeful retreat. I don’t get why they made movement based abilities also part of the rotation. It should just be some kinda opener not feel like i have to use VR just to use FR.
Technically speaking, we do have a slow. But due to how it functions, i think most people would agree that Vengeful Retreat wasn’t the typical slow spell/skill we’re used to on other classes. The fact that we ‘need’ to take Felblade to pair it with VR is also somewhat bitter. Yea, i can use Fel Rush instead, except my distance-guessing skills isn’t great.
Momentum is a more advanced playstyle that offers a choice for those who like the challenge, which understandably not everyone likes it. Thankfully Nemesis and Demonic was viable enough to not make Momentum mandatory.