No they didnt. Elemental focused on casting spells for big crits. Enhance you focused on your weapon attacks and totems for buffs.
Forget it you’re just a sad forum troll who cant understand people have different view points and playstyles.
Yeah Raigor!
You sad forum troll!
I agree with Raigor.
Seriously, though - given how modern wow devalues weapons, seems like it wouldn’t be that hard to bring back 2-handers but it would mostly just be an aesthetic thing at this point.
Mechanically, a 2-hander would need to proc things more often since one slow weapon instead of 2 faster ones but other than that I’m not sure it would make much difference since abilities don’t use weapon damage anymore.
Stormstrike, lava lash, windfurry - they don’t care if you are using a toothpick or 10 ton hammer. They just do a certain amount of attack power damage regardless. And since WF is only main hand now, I guess if they let you imbue a 2-hander with WF and flametongue at the same time, then you’d basically be in the same place.
So if people just want 2-hander back for asethetics, then it seems like it wouldn’t be that hard to do. On the other hand, if people want massive WF procs like vanilla, then that’s just not coming back. It was bad game design.
As for some of the other stuff -
- Searing totem buffing lava lash was generally loathed and should stay dead. No thanks on trying to keep track of whether searing is still in range of your target and having to continually redrop it for lava lash buffs.
- Mana already matters where it should - healing and utility. Mana mattering for damage was bad because it hurt sustained dps and modern wow has moved away from mana as a limiter on DPS for good reason.
- Frostbrand I wouldn’t mind keeping. Mainly for PvP. They could add back as a PvP talent the old glyph effect that combined frostbrand with flametongue and then maybe bake in the damage from old hailstorm.
- Old rockbiter weapon buff I don’t think we need back. Earth shock I guess the question is what would it do exactly and what would be its purpose? They just removed the BFA version of earth shock because it felt like unnecessary filler. You also don’t want earth shock competing with frost shock if frost shock is going to be our only slow.
- Sham rage I could get behind. We definitely need some defensive help.
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Searing totem buffed with lava lash wasnt generally loathed. Wheres your proof? Because blizzard removed it? They also removed frost shock from resto and enhance. Thats right you have zero proof. Typical retail player who only plays one type of content in wow.
Wrong, and even though your post history seems to indicate you have no interest in a good-faith discussion, I’m going to respond at length so others can see where I’m coming from if they’re following along. You’re welcome to try to get what I’m saying as well, but I’m not optimistic you will.
You missed the part where I narrowed the example down to an Enhancement-specced Shaman. You’re arguing that TBC gave you choice, you mentioned talents, and in order to make a comparison, I need to pick a spec. In Retail that’s trivial, but in TBC I guess I need to explain further. Keep in mind I was in college when TBC hit the shelves, I specifically remember picking up a copy with my 3 apartment roomies and then hitting the nextdoor pub for a drink before going home and diving in, and we started progression raiding in TBC when we realized the guilds we were all in from Vanilla were filled with terrible players. I played the entire expac as an Enhancement Shaman, got Hand of A’dal with Enhancement Shaman, and wiped on M’uru with a progression guild for multiple weeks straight (iirc) with Enhancement Shaman. Sometimes I still visit the Elitist Jerks Enh Sham theorycrafting forum post for nostalgia purposes.
So say you want to focus on weapon attacks and totemic buffs, as you say. That’s your goal. How many points, minimum, are you spending in the Enhancement tree? Well…
- If you want Shamanistic Rage to have any hope of getting enough mana back to use spells with any regularity, you’re at a minimum of 41 points already. That leaves you with 20 points remaining, so you can’t get either Nature’s Swiftness out of the Resto tree or Elemental Fury out of the Ele tree.
- At this point, you have 2 main choices that aren’t some sort of trivial split between the Ele and Resto trees (or just dumping more into Enh):
- You grab 2x Improved Fire Nova Totem out of the Ele tree for 17 points, minimum, and in the process shore up spell resists/shock damage/fire totem damage/shock spell cost reduction.
- You grab 3x Nature’s Guidance for 3% hit (which combined with the 6% hit from Dual Wield, if you go that route, puts you at enough hit to cap special attacks) for a minimum of 13 points in Resto, grabbing Totemic Focus from the second tier to reduce the cost of totems by 25% (which, if you’re twisting Windfury/Grace of Air and using any Fire totems whatsoever, is going to be huge in the long run).
- Any spare points from 17/41/0 and 0/41/13 would be very minor changes to abilities, not really affecting your playstyle at all.
- If you don’t care about Shamanistic Rage, Unleashed Rage requires 5 points to get you a 10% attack power buff on crit, which is really good. That’s a minimum of 40 points, and you’d be giving up your only real mechanism to generate mana beyond chain-chugging mana pots (and your only defensive cooldown) for a chance at Nature’s Swiftness or Elemental Fury.
- This would be extraordinarily hampering, but I guess an instant heal/Chain Lightning could be fun, or an extra 100% crit damage on Shocks could be fun.
- However, you can’t put 5 points in Unleashed Rage and only have 40 points in Enhancement if you choose to Dual Wield, unless you decide to totally skip the 6% hit bonus with 3x Dual Wield Specialization. You’re likely not skipping Stormstrike, nor 3x Mental Quickness (unless you want to gear for spell damage over Strength and obliterate your weapon attacks, which we established were a focus of the build, or just never use Shocks or fire totems because they would hit for nothing), nor would you likely want to cut anything from 5x Weapon Mastery because it’s just weapon damage (which, again, we’re focusing on weapon attacks, so that’s important). Mental Quickness + Weapon Mastery + Stormstrike is 9 points starting at 25 points in the tree, so you could put 1 point in Dual Wield to enable it and then go 5x Unleashed Rage, or just skip Dual Wield and fluff the tree up elsewhere. Otherwise, you’re going over 41 without Shamanistic Rage anyway.
- Let’s assume all you want is Stormstrike from the Enhancement tree and you don’t care about Unleashed Rage. As I mentioned before, when you hit 25 points in Enh you are staring at both Mental Quickness and Weapon Mastery, and if you max them out, even just putting 1 point in Stormstrike and stopping has you at a minimum of 34 points, leaving you with 27. But if we just get to Stormstrike, you STILL only have 30 points to put in other trees, which means you miss Elemental Mastery and Mana Tide totem (if for some reason you wanted to go high into Resto). For your extra points in both trees, you could do things like increase your spell hit (which, Shocks are considered special attacks and only require 9% hit, so this would only apply to Lightning Bolt/Chain Lightning, which you don’t cast as Enhancement), reducing the cast time/increasing the cast range of Lightning Bolt, increase the crit chance of lightning/healing spells, increase the effectiveness of Healing Stream/Mana Spring totems, etc. Minor things, really, that don’t help with weapon attacks at all, and just barely help with totem buffs that you would be sacrificing soooo much to get.
So when you say:
I don’t know what you’re talking about, really. Sure, you CAN do some mega-hybrid build, but that’s where my point about 2H Enhancement Shaman in BfA comes in: you can equip 2H weapons, even though you can’t use two abilities with them. If you’re going to hamper yourself that much in TBC for the sake of your own casual enjoyment, then I don’t see why you’re so against hampering yourself in BfA for your own casual enjoyment.
At this point, you need to do a better job of explaining what you’re talking about, because I don’t get what you mean.
And to be clear, I’d be happy to hear what your alternate build/playstyle was for an Enhancement build in TBC. My only point is comparing its viability to what you refuse to do in BfA is pertinent if you’re praising TBC for choice and slamming BfA because talents don’t affect playstyle.
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You are disingenuous about wanting to have a discussion. This discussion is over. Good riddance troll.
Bye bye cranky pants.
My recollection from the time is that it was a common topic on the forums - dissatisfaction with it. And in light of that, it wasn’t surprising to me when they removed it.
What type of content is that?
This is the epitome of the sad state of society we live in.
You claim you want to have a discussion.
When you are constantly proven wrong you constantly deny.
When you cant seem to dig yourself out of the hole you dug you name call.
Then in one last attempt of defiance you proudly proclaim nothing that everyone is wrong, you are right and you refuse to discuss anything anymore.
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I would really love it if Ele shaman could choose between using kiting/instants and standing in one place/hardcasting of playstyles. The class feels like a mix between mage/warlock to me.
It’s sorta like this now, but to a lesser extent. Like if you take the pvp talent control lava and icefury, you now have two schools to bait kicks with to avoid getting nature locked. Both hard casted tho. I like that kind of playstyle, and I wish more specs had impactful talents like these that changed the way you play.
Also, since enhance is getting all these Ele spells, how about sharing some of that crash lightning visual? 
just roll a ret or a dk in sl for 2hd weapons i got both ready.
Is this suppose to be some kind of slur or something? Does playing retail make you vanilla or something? Are classic players suppose to be some greater breed of humans?
enhancement shamans are looking really good for shadowlands with a few issues still to iron out.
the need to remove forceful winds and flat buff windfury its ok with the bfa ramp up play style but that play style is gone in sl.they also need to adress healing and defense a bit.
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He made a massive response that was grammatically sound with coherent arguments and points of discussion, and your response is “lol disingenuous”
The irony.
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