It kind of doesn’t. The vault rewards are better, but if you want to spam keys for hero items, you need to do 17s or higher.
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Asking
I mean if that’s what it takes for the M+ whining to stop, fine by me.
I’d even bring back the bonus loot tokens (only for raids) and increase the crest fragment drops.
Yet instead for asking for changes like that you guys prefer asking Blizz to neuter the rewards of the other game modes.
M+ is the most popular form of gameplay in WoW both in terms of player interest and player engagement.
M+ players completely dominate, raid-loggers are a minority in comparison.
You couldn’t be more wrong.
Agreed. They aren’t equal in gear, raiding gear is completely OP.
At no point does the game force you to do any M+. You don’t NEED to do M+ to progress. It’s like any other game with gear. Spend the time to gear up, the content is easier. If you don’t the content still doable but more difficult. As far as the system and how it works, it works fine and as intended. You are not punished because you and your raid team are burnt out on progression for a bit and decide to tackle some M+ as a sub. You get gear either way so that when you come back to the raid you haven’t fallen behind.
It’s a good system to both catch up and keep you caught up.
No lie there. I took one look at the 2 set bonus for my Frost mage it was no contest that I need to at least get that.
In any mmorpg.
While not a perfectly made survey by any standard, this really does show just how little people care about raiding anymore. Not only is M+ the most popular of any game mode, it more than doubles raiding. I mean hell, more people voted for Classic Hardcore, a fake game mode, than raiding.
Hopefully, someone at Blizzard actually uses that as justification to stop treating M+ like second-class content.
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Full gearing an entire raid in 4 set from just 1 difficulty, direct drops only, will happen on week 7 with perfect drops.
Math not adding up. Maybe you aren’t factoring in Omni token and AOTC token.
I am factoring in the Sarkareth token, but not the aotc token because I was assuming normal.
Factoring in the AOTC omni token, it’s week 5.
is it a good strategy to be designing the game to eject players, when the game is already a shadow of what it once was population-wise?
I wont even pretend that i have a fix but having 2 competing pve gear paths but 1 is by design infinitely repeatable with no diminishing returns does tend to put the players who repeatedly use that content quite a bit up on those who dont. And its not like you need an “io score” for your average guild raid team adding an actual barrier to entry for the repeatable path.
7 weeks with perfect drops. Compared to at least way better odds of getting an upgrade because you decided to do some extra stuff and mostly guaranteed to have “something”. I’m not really seeing an issue with that. Extra work is rewarded accordingly.
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Except they TUNE the raids with the expectation that these players also do M+, meaning you are kind of forced to M+ or raid is honestly too hard and a nightmare.
Hmm players choose the path that doesn’t require 2-3 hours of straight play at a time like raiding
That gives higher ilvl in vault then raiding because raid gear in vault can give you loot off earlier bosses vs later ones and can’t go up as high in ilvl as M+ can from vault
A path that is endlessly farmable with no lockouts
And a path that requires just 5 people
M+ wins in popularity only because it is miles ahead in the time vs rewards thing compared to raiding.
Raiding is like walking
M+ is like running
If you want to get to the finish line as quick as possible, what would you do?
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I get that line of thinking, I’m just saying that the gap between those who put in the extra work and those who don’t shouldn’t be ~15 ilvls after week 1 (which is bigger than almost every tier set this patch).
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This is one of the easiest raid tiers since Emerald Nightmare. Your narrative does not add up.
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Which raids you talking about? Because you can walk right into normal raid and not touch M+ and still clear it and get the loot and have the Vault produce loot.
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Normal, sure. But H Raz for example was a fight where if your average ilvl from Heroic was only around 400 was a LOT HARDER then if people did M+ and were closer to 410-415.
Heroic Rashok even, another good example that if your just doing raiding, it will take you a lot longer to get wyrm crests for gear upgrades to beat his DPS check.
You can walk into +10s and clear them just fine with no raid loot.
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So… Players do the M+ to outgear a challenge to make it easier? This is seemingly like basic RPG 101. It’s not that they can’t clear it, they’re just getting better gear to make it easier to clear.
Because it is more fun. It gives loot slower, less powerful, less visually pleasing, and lower ilvl yet people continue to play it, and play it more than raiding and with greater enthusiasm, because it is fun.
But a lot of players like myself hate M+ and this is ONLY why we do it. People like “Oh look how popular M+ is” but a LOT OF US wouldn’t do it at all if we had the choice to not do it without feeling gimped about it.
I think gear upgrades made it even worse, since killing say 4 bosses a week is only 40 fragments which is only 2 wyrm crests so it would take you so long for upgrades if you don’t farm 11’s to 15’s to get those wyrm fragments!