- BFA being given classic access for no additional cost (so THEY get a lure)
- Sharding
- Likelihood of the late vanilla nerfed AV that is the same as PS version
- Loot trading
- 1.12 talents that helped trivialize content
- $15/month for 14 year old close-ended content
As someone who played throughout the entirety of vanilla and left a couple expansions in (should have left a lot sooner), and lets face it PSs are not going away (I personally do not play on them), is Blizzard at all interested in luring players like myself back? Are they willing to make any sort of an effort to win back my patronage and that of players like myself?
Beyond character perpetuity, what exactly is Blizzard offering ex-players that PSs are not already offering (and may actually end up doing better)?
When Classic was announced after over 10 years of lobbying, I had visions of Old AV, stable server pops and economies, original strength Strat and Scholo, etc. Blizzcon was like a wet fart and left me void of any hype toward the project. I feel that ultimately blizzard shifted gears and decided that classic was not for us who begged for over a decade, but rather for the declining population of BFA players which includes arguably the entirety of the wall-of-no players. They got rewarded, and we got... what exactly?
What is it Blizzard is willing to do to lure us ex-players back then?
They'll lure two kinds of subscribers that aren't currently subscribing:
Both of these kinds of users are attractive as potential customers for Blizzard; they get to kill two birds with one stone. People who refuse to play due to the differences since Vanilla are insignificant: the number of players who joined after Vanilla was irrelevant is much greater than the number of players who experienced it who will care. If they can get 90%+ of the way there, it won't matter.
It could be that they aren't trying to appeal to people like that in the first place.
- People who don't play WoW these days, who did play Vanilla, who are willing to overlook the differences and sub for Classic
- People who currently play on private realms who are interested in a more modernized experience
Both of these kinds of users are attractive as potential customers for Blizzard; they get to kill two birds with one stone. People who refuse to play due to the differences since Vanilla are insignificant: the number of players who joined after Vanilla was irrelevant is much greater than the number of players who experienced it who will care. If they can get 90%+ of the way there, it won't matter.
It could be that they aren't trying to appeal to people like that in the first place.
I played on a few vanilla PS these past few years, and there's a few things that will turn me to pay Blizzard for a vanilla server over playing on a private one.
1) Ethics.
If it's available officially I would rather support the developer. I have always been against people playing the current version of any game on a private server.
2) Competent staff.
One of the PS I played on (it was where Nost data was transferred to) had corrupt GMs who were spawning in-game currency. I trust Blizzard staff who are earning a decent wage will not resort to this. If they do (as in what happened to OldSchool Runescape with a mod there) the perpetrator will be fired and then taken to court.
3) Server stability.
PS have always had unstable servers. I believe a multimillion $ company can provide a better service and stability.
4) Larger community.
The official version of any game is always the more populated and trusted.
5) Ease of access.
I don't have to worry about malware, reconfiguring my realmlist or any such thing.
6) Wipes are far less likely.
When Nost closed, I was devastated as I felt like I had lost everything that I had put ~8 months into. My guild full of Chinese folk I would've never seen myself playing with were gone, just like that. I had no way to contact them. On an official server, there will be b-net integration and better communication so if they do eventually decide to do a full wipe we shall know far in advance.
All of these points will keep the game thriving, as it spreads through word of mouth and is visible to all returning WoW players, including those hundreds of thousands who typically only come back at the start of an expansion. It will be straight forward to install and highly promoted by people on Twitch, YouTube and other platforms where they don't risk getting on Blizzard's bad side for their promotions of the game.
1) Ethics.
If it's available officially I would rather support the developer. I have always been against people playing the current version of any game on a private server.
2) Competent staff.
One of the PS I played on (it was where Nost data was transferred to) had corrupt GMs who were spawning in-game currency. I trust Blizzard staff who are earning a decent wage will not resort to this. If they do (as in what happened to OldSchool Runescape with a mod there) the perpetrator will be fired and then taken to court.
3) Server stability.
PS have always had unstable servers. I believe a multimillion $ company can provide a better service and stability.
4) Larger community.
The official version of any game is always the more populated and trusted.
5) Ease of access.
I don't have to worry about malware, reconfiguring my realmlist or any such thing.
6) Wipes are far less likely.
When Nost closed, I was devastated as I felt like I had lost everything that I had put ~8 months into. My guild full of Chinese folk I would've never seen myself playing with were gone, just like that. I had no way to contact them. On an official server, there will be b-net integration and better communication so if they do eventually decide to do a full wipe we shall know far in advance.
All of these points will keep the game thriving, as it spreads through word of mouth and is visible to all returning WoW players, including those hundreds of thousands who typically only come back at the start of an expansion. It will be straight forward to install and highly promoted by people on Twitch, YouTube and other platforms where they don't risk getting on Blizzard's bad side for their promotions of the game.
The devil is in the details. We still don't know what the actual release of Classic is going to look like. We fight to get it as close as we can to Vanilla. And then everyone can choose to play, or not.
So when that time comes you can make your decision about whether or not it's "close enough" for you. Expecting a 100% satisfactory version of whatever you have in your head is probably setting yourself up for disappointment.
So when that time comes you can make your decision about whether or not it's "close enough" for you. Expecting a 100% satisfactory version of whatever you have in your head is probably setting yourself up for disappointment.
11/08/2018 04:42 PMPosted by DonataliusIts clear to me that retailers are the target audience for Classic, not the old timers.
They will herd in retailers and then slowly change the game to suit their taste. In short, they will ruin Classic just as they ruined retail.
That is a legitimate fear.
11/08/2018 04:27 PMPosted by BombfuryPeople who refuse to play due to the differences since Vanilla are insignificant
This is HUGE...
There's a small, vocal minority here on the forums complaining about the fact that if there is sharding in the starting areas at launch, they won't play.
Blizzard won't miss them. Especially when there are much greater numbers that are willing to overlook things like that (look at places like reddit and others out there) just to get an official vanilla-like server.
We were never going to get a straight 1.12 port (or 1.1 progression), they were just too caught up in trying to say "We told you so" to see objectively.
Classic is shaping up to be great. I quit halfway through Legion, but I am coming back with my 2 accounts for Classic (might pick up a 3rd), and my wife is coming back with her 2 accounts for Classic as well. So that's a potential of 5 accounts coming back because this Vanilla veteran played the demo, watched the Classic panel, and liked what he saw. (Also supports limited sharding at launch in Classic.)
The target demographic of Classic may not be those that are yelling the loudest here in CD.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermissut rather for the declining population of BFA players which includes arguably the entirety of the wall-of-no players.
Those people are not going to waste their HS space or time with Classic, since you also get the base WoW game for free , are you going to download and install it?
The target demographic is the one that makes them the most money.11/08/2018 06:11 PMPosted by FallanaaThe target demographic of Classic may not be those that are yelling the loudest here in CD.
The only people who have proven that they will pay anything are retail players who have already succumbed to neo-blizzards marketing.
Raid progression, pre-1.12 talents, debuff limits were all in vanilla at one point and blizzard has deemed them unworthy of discussion so far.
What they have talked about? Things that never existed in vanilla at all. Loot sharing, sharding, modern api for macros and addons, modern graphics and shaders and textures, automatic auto looting.
All the current classic changes appease retail players because they are familiar.
Then there is all the things they brought up at Blizzcon that were completely irrelevent and only served to appease retail subscribers. "No flying in classic" because retail players have played both BfA and Legion with no flying and once flying was released in Legion everyone unanimously agreed it killed world interaction between players. Flying did not exist in vanilla so it is pointless to say it won't be in classic since it's obvious it never would be.
Blizzard is playing a game of smoke and mirrors with Classic so they can get close enough to steal your wallet.
11/08/2018 09:46 PMPosted by AproposNo flying in classic" because retail players have played both BfA and Legion with no flying and once flying was released in Legion everyone unanimously agreed it killed world interaction between players.
Lol no, not 'everyone'.
OP
Why do they need to lure you back when you're posting on an alt made in 2018 while playing retail? You have never left.
Why do they need to lure you back when you're posting on an alt made in 2018 while playing retail? You have never left.
11/08/2018 09:52 PMPosted by Studmuffyn11/08/2018 09:46 PMPosted by AproposNo flying in classic" because retail players have played both BfA and Legion with no flying and once flying was released in Legion everyone unanimously agreed it killed world interaction between players.
Lol no, not 'everyone'.
Ion gave a definite answer to make reporting troll threads easier, as well as alleviating anxiety. Given how often I've seen "WoW tokens are tradeable" pop up in this sub-forum, there's a lot of misinformation out there. Whether said misinformation is deliberate or not is a coin toss.
11/08/2018 10:23 PMPosted by Idun11/08/2018 09:52 PMPosted by Studmuffyn...
Lol no, not 'everyone'.
Ion gave a definite answer to make reporting troll threads easier, as well as alleviating anxiety. Given how often I've seen "WoW tokens are tradeable" pop up in this sub-forum, there's a lot of misinformation out there. Whether said misinformation is deliberate or not is a coin toss.
Huh?
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- BFA being given classic access for no additional cost (so THEY get a lure)
That was entirely expected though. What was not expected was that being the only option.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- Sharding
Them keeping to their word that they wanted to avoid the vanilla launch? Everyone seems to have forgotten that statement early on. Although that said sharding is not the way to go. Perma sharding though will make it DoA for me.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- Likelihood of the late vanilla nerfed AV that is the same as PS version
While I prefer the older AV I am not surprised, I don't think many people are surprised.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- Loot trading
Not much to say. Does not belong, but they have their reasons. Their reasoning is fairly legitimate but I still disagree. It however is not a killer for me.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- 1.12 talents that helped trivialize content
Standing between a stale patch and an ever evolving vanilla experience. Which do you think was cheaper? Stale ofc. Which do you think of the patches in vanilla was experienced by most players? 1.12 ofc. Do I agree with their decisions? No not really. But they have actual reasoning not like what you are giving.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- $15/month for 14 year old close-ended content
What is this even?. . .
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by ThermissBeyond character perpetuity, what exactly is Blizzard offering ex-players that PSs are not already offering (and may actually end up doing better)?
Three words. Attraction and Security. Being an official server means it will not be taken down randomly and not managed in under-funded personal stand point. It also means it will attract a far greater number of players than private servers did which will increase the community size and the longevity of the servers.
They're already doing it, don't take this the wrong way but if you are going to be picky then it has to be questioned whether you truly wanted classic in the general format or not.11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by ThermissWhat is it Blizzard is willing to do to lure us ex-players back then?
Most of us understood that when we get classic it will not have certain elements we want. Old AV was no surprise, I wish it would be there seriously. Our primary expectations were keeping it in the realm of vanilla WoW. It's the things that never existed in vanilla era that we must worry over.
11/08/2018 04:17 PMPosted by Thermiss- $15/month for 14 year old close-ended content
What is this even?. . .
It means all Blizz is doing is dusting off a 14 year old database (updating the schema) and wiring it up to the current front-end. No new content, nor will there ever be. Just a reanimated frankenpatch of what used to be with no further development at all.
Now, the irony is this is basically what many non-subscribers wanted. Blizz though, has decided to tweak it with non-Vanilla features (that seem solely focused on what Retailers want) and then throw it out to remain static forever more. All this while charging non-subscribers the premium fee for an in-development AAA MMO.
What is truly comical is how dumbfounded so many seem to be that can't fathom this concept, and even worse, blindly defend it. Everyone always knew they would have to pay for Classic, just not the premium fee for non-premium service. A simple box price and/or a reduced subscription would have covered all of their work performed resurrecting Classic and made a profit (while covering server expense) AND brought a lot of non-subscribers back! No problems with retailers getting it for free at all, it is the seeming rejection of the very group that clamored for Classic all these years that is so incomprehensible.
11/09/2018 12:13 AMPosted by LyychA simple box price and/or a reduced subscription would have covered all of their work performed resurrecting Classic and made a profit (while covering server expense)
How do you know this?
11/09/2018 12:13 AMPosted by LyychNo problems with retailers getting it for free at all,
Everyone who pays a WoW Sub gets it 'free'.
How do you not? The scope of work this time around is a mere fraction of what it was when they initially built Vanilla, surely this isn't eluding anyone?
As for your "free" comment, I honestly don't think that deserves anything more than a pfft.
As for your "free" comment, I honestly don't think that deserves anything more than a pfft.
Personally I think Classic has been way more grunt work on the part of developers than people understand. Or that Blizzard expected when they started the project.
If you went and suggested that this is as simple as slapping the old game together with the new one to a Blizzard programmer they would probably laugh in your !@#$ing face and walk away.
If you went and suggested that this is as simple as slapping the old game together with the new one to a Blizzard programmer they would probably laugh in your !@#$ing face and walk away.
11/08/2018 10:30 PMPosted by Studmuffyn11/08/2018 10:23 PMPosted by Idun...
Ion gave a definite answer to make reporting troll threads easier, as well as alleviating anxiety. Given how often I've seen "WoW tokens are tradeable" pop up in this sub-forum, there's a lot of misinformation out there. Whether said misinformation is deliberate or not is a coin toss.
Huh?
Oh, you were responding to the "everyone said flying killed the world!", I was responding to why Ion brought up flying in the Classic panel in the first place. XD
11/09/2018 12:30 AMPosted by LyychAs for your "free" comment, I honestly don't think that deserves anything more than a pfft.
Especially since it happens to be true?
11/09/2018 12:30 AMPosted by LyychHow do you not? The scope of work this time around is a mere fraction of what it was when they initially built Vanilla, surely this isn't eluding anyone?
So?
11/09/2018 12:13 AMPosted by Lyychovered all of their work performed resurrecting Classic and made a profit (while covering server expense)
That doesn't mean all of that is 'covered' does it? You act as if this is something they busted out over a weekend in someones garage while drinking beers and watching Netflix.
Look , I all for them offering a cheaper classic only sub for those that want it, and it could still happen.
11/09/2018 12:46 AMPosted by Idun11/08/2018 10:30 PMPosted by Studmuffyn...
Huh?
Oh, you were responding to the "everyone said flying killed the world!", I was responding to why Ion brought up flying in the Classic panel in the first place. XD
lol yah, no worries, yah flight would be great , we could see all the 2d buildings looking like cardbaord cutouts from the fair! :OP