Looks like MM nerfs coming next

PVP Arenas
42

Hunter’s been my main for a decade or so, but I do play other classes. This mechanic has always been my least favorite of the hunter mechanics to play with and definitely against. When all of your kill potential is tied to it, it’s really frustrating to play with it into comps that have multiple disarms and micro cc’s that they’re able to save for it. Whenever aimed shot is tuned high, it’s obviously mega frustrating to get oneshot out of stealth with dt aimed.

If you consider the state of the class for this whole post-legion iteration of marks, it’s way too hot or cold. It oneshots and everyone complains about it, they have to way nerf it, then it doesn’t oneshot and you die before you are ever able to accomplish anything. Whether it’s something completely new or just a better build combo that they enable (i.e. unnerring + windrunner’s guidance being available together), you just have to look at the removal of this specific mechanic as a good thing long term imo.

43

This is the first round of patch notes. They’re always spectacularly incomplete at this stage.

A bit too early for doomsaying.

MM will need something to compensate though, that’s for sure.

44

They might me doing things in phases. It seems with a few nerfs/tuning that have been handed out revolve around TTK whether that’s too much damage too fast or too little too slow due to survivability. It looks like they are making the rounds little by little.

Maybe once they have TTK pulled back a touch they’ll work on CC chains. Using me as an example probably the Bender pet unbreakable Scream as well as his splash damage on Blast and Death hits. This could also be why they tossed up a buff on Psychic Link for cleave in AOE. Not exactly a point you’d dump in for PvP but for PvE it may have to make up for spike loss from Bender’s Inescapable Torment cleave.

If they can tune the CC, rework Mindgames (though now it generates insanity in the upcoming patch) damage, Catharsis/DesP buffing and a few other damage spikes we will be in a more rounded spot. Though I’d still prefer more of a pressure class than a lockdown/spike class in PvP but I’m not at Blizz.

PvE feels dreadful on this guy, though. Considering benching, tbh. Probably the least smooth class I’ve played in PvE but that’s another discussion.

45

This quote alone explains the nerf. Getting rapid fired for 250k every minute is a bit ouch.

46

But they did compensate you, you now have 10% cooldown reduction on aimed shot and rapid fire

47

On that topic, that really has to be a placeholder. Reducing the cooldown of those abilities is nearly useless at that capacity. Trueshot cdr on Aimed is only a thing because it’s tied to reduced focus cost as well. It won’t net you more aimed shots, and 2 seconds off rapidfire is not meaningful when you consider surging shots resets.

48

Double tap is going to have been removed primarily for PVE reasons. Maybe PVP was further supporting evidence but ya’ll need to remember WoW is a PVE game first and foremost and a PVP game after the fact.

If they thought double tap was fine in PVE 0 chance they’d remove it.

Going out on a limb and taking a guess that double tap was making MM impossible to balance in PVE as it is in PVP, and so they’re removing the major culprit so they can adjust MM away from the “nuke the world every 1 minute and afk otherwise” thing they’ve had going on awhile now.

It’s likely to be a healthy and overall good change for MM in the long run for both PVP and PVE.

49

thats how dks felt when we got slammed

50

Explain why it’s a good change without saying that it opens the door for future buffs.

If it were a good change, it would be a combination buff and nerf by the very same logic.

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51

Because any spec that either 1shots you or it loses is garbage game design from both sides of the equation.

It’s not even about opening the door to future buffs, the base design straight up doesn’t work so they need to do something.

52

If that were an accurate assessment, MM would be one of the easiest specs to play in the game.

That is not an accurate assessment, of course.

53

Chaos bolt would like a word with you

54

Good…

Nerf this trash to the ground.

55

We’re in agreement. We would also have some questions about what’s going to happen next if blizzard removed something like shadow dance in lieu of a seemingly weak passive. Big difference in don’t nerf me bro and being genuinely curious/concerned about it.

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56

Agree. Having 2 “Nukes” to replace Chimera Shot then adding in an ability to double its damage on command has been causing problems for the spec since they designed it that way.

The only thing I have to ask is, why do this on live instead of day 1 of Alpha?

So many things were done in an attempt to balance the current toolkit, and I largely suspect it’s also why they have Aimed Shot at such an incredibly long base cast. As one of the few specs that will now no longer have an offensive CD that increases damage, I don’t see MM performing without changing Aimed Shot design casting conditions, or Trueshot’s design which they’ve not commented on at all.

Odd how many years it took them to figure out what hunters have been saying for half a decade, but also odd to commit to a change during a live release with no attempt to look at what will be missing. Spec will play like molasses during arena games while everyone else is playing Forza speed specs.

57

While I agree insane burst needs to be nerfed - it needs to be nerfed across the board for a lot of classes.

Then you need to take a look at the rest of the spec/class for compensation. If all they can do is “decent” damage they won’t be able to compete without a proper look over for control/defensives.

I’m leveling a Hunter for PvE even after this change since I feel the rotation in PvE feels a lot better and is more forgiving than SPriests awful clunk in PvE but in PvP there’s no question a class like SPriest does more than excel and if I was doing arenas and had a choice between me or a Hunter I’d pick the priest every time. Far more utility and a lot more spread pressure.

That’s one of my gripes with PvE/PvP balancing. Some specs feel awful in PvE and great in PvP and others are the opposite. I’ll probably wind up benching this priest completely in favor of a ranged that just plays well. I don’t care about being top in any area I just care about it being able to perform at a notable level and it has to be fun. SPriest in PvE ain’t it.

Hunters should probably be looked at in other ways if the burst is to be removed to make them more viable in Arena. I kinda feel like they do good in BGs but at the same time they’re not on my priority list of targets like Warriors, Rogues and DHs.

Like before SPriests had massive CC chains we had a disarm. Helpful against melee. We don’t have a disarm anymore and now instead have broken CC chains, 8999 (some would say over 9000) instant procs and survival kit that is probably the best in the game. Like that was the exact thing that shouldn’t have been done - overcompensation.

Here with Hunters it’s just being ripped and that’s it. 10% CD reduction is nothing. They don’t have great healing or mitigation, they don’t have CC like other classes, they just have insane burst at range. Remove the burst and now what?

I keep saying this over and over PvP needs to be reworked to a game of angles and not straight lines. Crazy CC chains? Stop it. Insane burst? No. Utility should be used to gain leverage in fights, not outright nullify the other player. Damage output should be strong but not deleting people without the ability to respond and counter.

Like there’s very very clear flaws with the game and several classes that are literally the stand-outs like this guy I’m on. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to put things in check a nudge at a time.

The problem is what we see here - Blizzard gets stupid heavy with nerfs because they can’t be bothered to think. That’s it. Instead they either run things into the ground or design classes in such ways that make no sense in the larger scale when a class has a lot of excess. It’s mind-boggling.

58

Hopefully this is the start to removing cringe burst abilities in favor of more consistent throughput with damage rotations.

59

Replace double tap with a talent if you use two aimed shots in a row(within 10 secs of one another or unlimited time) you get a free lock n load proc and maybe also give rapid fire a 10-25% cd reduction.

They still need to rework the hunter spec trees AND hunter class tree. They need to make the one talent right above the capstone double kill comand or 35% damage kill comand 1 talent instead of 2 to free up 1 point to allow pve bm and pvp bm to get 3 capstones and pve and potiently a pet build pvp survival to get 3 capstones.

60

This is optimistic thinking that Blizzard will actually give much of ANYTHING to Hunters. We haven’t had a cool fun ability added since they changed Survival to melee with the complete class overhaul. They removed most of the covenant abilities from shadowlands and half assed baked them into random nodes across multiple talent trees. The only one we kept baseline as a Hunter is Death Chakram and they didn’t even give us the free explosive to go with it, they turned that into a separate talent in the MM tree.

Blizzard has historically been so lazy with Hunter and the replacement they came up with Double tap really proves it to me…10% cooldown reduction on aimed shot and rapid fire…I actually can’t believe they were such trash devs to even consider this a replacement.

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