whelp dk really is done for
31 Likes
I thought the title was trolling but no, someone has really taken whoever was in charge of deathknight balance outback with a shotgun.
21 Likes
My borderline delusional hope is that we’re getting a rework in TWW on the scale of Outlaw or Demolock and they’re just focused on that.
9 Likes
I wont be buying it they let my class be dead for 2 years
9 Likes
Lets hope they add us to Season of Discovery or something because i just give up on them doing anything with us on retail at this point.
1 Like
Not surprised. They have this class exactly where they want it. B tier trash that takes twice the effort of other classes for the same results.
18 Likes
Issue is, everyone wanted all the damage to be thrown into Obliterate. And so it was. Then everyone complained about it.
Now if you do a rework and take away all the big Oblit hits, everyone is going to complain. Their hands are kind of tied.
A rework would be nice and one can hope for it. But what are they going to do that doesn’t piss everyone off?
3 Likes
Gut KM and add some version of Thorim’s Invocation and tell people to download and add-on to combine the numbers so they can see their “big Oblits”.
Otherwise yes, there’s nothing they can practically do that won’t piss people off that want big Obliterates that overshadow everything and everyone else doesn’t want big Obliterates because they want other abilities to do reasonable damage and have a priority in the rotation. And people that want big Obliterates will 100% never support having to line up resources and buffs like Arms does for their big Mortal Strikes.
And they still have to address the resource glut - even outside of BoS - which means nerfing a ton of Obliterate talents like Frigid Executioner and Murderous Efficiency.
I suppose the best option (which would probably leave no one happy) is to gut KM & the Obliterate rune generation talents so that Obliterate falls down heavily in damage (which needs to happen regardless for the health of the spec) and then add a new ability in Deathbringer that chunks like the one for Colossus to keep the “big hit” feeling.
1 Like
Wish they would. Allowing it to stack twice was doubling down on a horrible idea >.<
They should probably just split the spec at this point since the two playstyles obviously need more room to build than they’re willing to put the effort into, and they both hate each other.
Like, I am absolutely in Haha Big Number Go Brr camp, but there needs to be more complexity to that game play than Push Button, then weave FS-Oblit for the next 8 seconds and hope you don’t get hit with a knock back, and there needs to be options to shift damage out of it and into other skills to encourage a variety of builds.
But that’s more effort than the people who get paid for it are apparently willing to put in.
5 Likes
Actually, they just need to tune something else to be appropriately bursty. There just needs to be a burst option that hits relatively hard, does not need to be oblit.
2 Likes
Boo hoo. Do it anyways. Take out 2h Frost as well since that just another reason why Frost is in the place that its in.
2 Likes
Thats not the problem at all its no healing
1 Like
yep, we don’t need a rework to be good, we just need all the pvp nerfs removed. this whole rework thing is a setup anyway, even if they rework DK the dev on the team who votes no every time we need buffs is still gonna be there, the dev who nerfs us every time i beat the 
out of him in epics and randoms is still gonna be there. they will spend a boatload of time reworking DK only for it to still be trash because blizz hasn’t laid off the problem yet.
5 Likes
We were fine before they chipped away at us with nerfs every single hotfix. The wound damage one was the final nail in the coffin though, they need to undo that, the necrotic wounds, and revert the armor changes.
It’s honestly insulting how the classes that were better than pre-nerf DK avoided nerfs this entire time.
3 Likes
By adding a 3rd playstyle, “masterfrost” the original playstyle. Removing that is a reason why people went up in arms.
2-hand frost being there is fine.
The talents needs to be optimized better.
6 Likes
Most everyone hated masterfrost. It removed Obliterate and Rime almost completely.
Its really not. The issues with 2h Frost have been pointed out since BFA when people were crying to get it back and most of those people have quit the game completely. Its not a problem with talents, its a problem with the weapon and how it functions within a DW spec.
2 Likes
Pretty much. The weapon selection isn’t the problem, anyone who thinks it is doesn’t know jack and is probably a BoS enjoyer salty that they’re being forced into playing Obliteration by gearing and damage (SUCKS DOESN’T IT). The problem is the tree and the way it’s designed and balanced. Frankly, all three of the DK trees are a fustercluck. Blood actually works well but it only has one build.
10 Likes
Except it kinda is. You very easily could’ve just added 30% Obliterate damage to Obliteration and called it day, objectively achieving everything 2h has “brought” without creating any friction within the spec and not “stealing” 4 years~ of design space to make 2h Obliteration viable and instead make Frost Death Knight better.
Compared to DW, 2h:
- Loses out on Icecap procs (50% less, statistically 1 less Pillar per 5min)
- Loses out on KM procs (about 24% less)
- Loses out on Shattering Blade
- Loses out on a 2nd Runeforge
- Loses out on with CBR (50% less but 50% of 0 is still 0)
It’s the same gearing with minimal changes. And, as someone that played 2h through SLs and played Obliteration even when it was trash - and it still is - I’m not “salty” because 2h returned, I’m “salty” because it was:
- Hamfisted back in instead of being agnostic for the spec
- Has taken the entire design space of the spec for the past 4 years
- Is most definitely responsible for Obliterate cleave being a thing for the spec
If I had known 6 years ago that 2h would just end up be this garbage Warrior/Ret cosplay and not “Frost Death Knight but with a 2h”, I wouldn’t have supported its return.
As do most specs, especially tanks. Guardian is possibly the only one that has some flexibility between two real builds but outside that, having one build that you play in all content is very standard for tanks.
1 Like
By your own statement here you could absolutely add a dual wield equivalent to Might in the spec with at least 20-30% increased Frost Strike damage and Frost Strike proccing Rime while dual wielding.
They could easily go in and take the Oblit+ damage talents and make them choice nodes that have the option to increase Frost Strike damage, or Howling Blast damage, or Remorseless Winter damage. Hell, they could even add a talent that lets auto attacks proc an instant damage Remorseless Winter in such a way that only dual wield is going to take it, say like your autoattacks have a 10% chance to reset the cooldown of Remorseless Winter and it deals 100% of it’s damage instantly. They could easily add a choice node that has Killing Machine affect Frost Strike instead of Obliterate. They could make the cleave from Death and Decay just baseline to the abilities it grants that to. They could make DnD just an aura like Remorseless Winter.
The DF talent system gives them so many options. This is evidenced by things like the Havoc tree, or the Feral tree, or the Enhancement tree. It’s not a problem with dual wield vs 2h, it’s a problem with that the devs don’t even bother to give us more than the absolute bare minimum as a class
Hell, they could do those right now with my cockamamie spitball numbers, as is with absolutely zero adjustments, and it probably wouldn’t even break the spec too bad. It wouldn’t put us even in the top 5.
It’s not the weapon choice, it’s the halfassed design
9 Likes