Let’s see if Ziqo boosts one. That’s the test to see what’s op.
Totally agreed. Now that I am geared I pulled threat twice in BWL, losing my WBs early on. Sad because I really wanted to see how well I could parse.
I like the ide of Shock and Awe getting a buff while decreasing healing. Helps with preventing Shockadin being God-King in pvp. I’m not sure a Libram is needed to flip it, Hpal has plenty of healing power already.
I think using set bonuses to build a role is part of the problem. Mages can hybrid heal based on runes, not set bonuses. To my knowledge no role/spec (other than Shockadin) is based purely on set bonuses; set bonuses merely enhance or improve. Why is Shockadin such a snowflake in this way? Why do I need 6 piece t2 just to start playing?
I like this idea a lot. Give us more PvE presence while limited PvP overpower. Could use threat reduction as well.
Interesting idea. Probably very powerful in PvP, but having a real execute would be nice.
I was thinking about something like this as well. Scale off the appropriate thing. I will say, however, since we have such as fast weapon and decent melee crit, Art of War isn’t terrible for us.
I like this. It’s annoying getting to 5 stacks then needing to wait on CD. I also would like the stacks to proc on self-healing, so you can pre-stack.
- Avengers shield is only good for single-target when we use the current Libram, so this likely doesn’t make Avengers shield actually good. The reduced CD would also be very powerful in PvP.
- I like the CD reduction on Holy Wrath, good idea.
- Dealing 80% less damage to players seems inappropriate here. I don’t understand why these things are together.
Have you seen the rune changes in phase 5? There is no longer a CD reduction to 0; it is always 3. That was the biggets nerf to Shockadin output, but clearly necessary for PvP balance.
Making this raid-wide would add SOME utility to Hpal – not a ton of healing, but given how much stacking happens in fights, this would still be valuable.
For Shockadin, especially with 4 piece t2, consecrate heals a quite nicely. Allowing that to heal the entire melee group, maybe tanks depending on positioning, gives the healer-shoackdin a lot of extra value. With 6 piece t2 and raid-wide consecrate then Shockadin is viable to replace a healer.
Suggestion:
Stop balancing Holy Paladin abilities and gear around some meme spec that people cry about in PvP. No one cares about PvP except the vocal 10 people on the forums.
It was always a problem for Blizzard, even back in Vanilla (and somehow still now in Classic), to balance classes for PvE and PvP at the same time. It is nearly impossible to do so; it is a fool’s errand. The only real solution is to stop trying.
Either go the route of making abilities have completely different effects inside BGs.
Or stop trying to balance PvP at the expense of the balance of classes in the game mode with substantially more players.
Classic has never been built around or balanced around PvP. It is a PvE game with some opportunity for PvP. Shockadin is brutal in PvP, for sure, I can 1v1 just about anyone or anything.
PvP is not the problem for Shockadin, PvE is. We lack threat reduction. We lack raid utility (less utility than Ret). Consecrate healing is nice, but being limited to party is a horrible gimp. Tier-2 Holy 6-piece SEEMS cool, until you realize that you will OOM insanely fast due to the loss of Crusader Strike.
Side note, why do so many call Shockadin a “meme” spec? It is explicitly supported by runes and tier; what makes it meme? Because it doesn’t perform as well? Is Beast Mastery Hunter meme if it performs worse than Survival?
Shockadin is powerful, but it falls short of every other DPS class without making up for it with raid utility. It is also insanely stupid that our viability is locked into ZG tier set. We need runes that make Shockadin viable as either a hybrid healer or pure dps without the NEED for a set bonus. How will this ever scale into the future?
The idea behind the Libram is from how I tank; I libram swap between the Captain America Libram (Libram of Avenging) and Libram of the Devoted depending on if I’m pulling one mob (ie boss) or a pack.
The change to Shock and Awe would require all Hpals taking it to forever be ‘unable to provide meaningful help’ if something goes wrong in a raid/dungeon. But being able to ‘hotswap’ a Libram in and suddenly they can heal, allows for flexibility.
…plus Libram of Holy Alacrity is just plain junk. 0.2 seconds is nothing; heck you won’t even notice it because of the reaction time to notice that Shock is ‘back up’ [for use] will likely take around 150ms to even register in your brain.
So, might as well make it a purposeful Libram. - Literally. Libram of the Consecrated would be a better choice for a Shockadin that only had 15 Reals to spend, and wasn’t going to be hit by anything (so no blocking attacks for Devoted to work with).
Stop. Smoking. Weed. This whole argument is weak tea. I think we know the cause. Additionally, If you are not thinking about your next spell while the current one is being cast or GCD is running, you are doing it wrong. Stop hitting the “water pipe”.
There REAL problem with Holy Shock is that it is half the range as other heals. Maybe just add a longer range for the heal side, but not the damage side. Holy Shock is a lame duck when it comes to Healing, IMO. T1 set piece doesn’t even get benefit from it. It is absolute garbage outside of Shockadin.
the problem with saying that wow has never been balanced for pvp is it leaves alot to explain as there have been plenty of times where it directly was balanced for pvp with almost 0 pve implications for the nerfs or buffs.
of course they balance some things for pvp as they should.
shockadins when they were on the ptr prenerf were massively op (laughably so) hell even its current incarnation there are plenty of people saying its very strong.
i dont know how they could balance it to also do well in pve aside from some sort of stacking thing or something without becoming massively op in pvp.
Lol that’s it? Wait until you run into. Boomies Starfire for 5.5k + 600 ticking dots…then there is star fall… then barkskin and Regen haha or a shaman who won’t die ticking 400 flameshocks, totems, 3k l bursts … and you complain about a shockadin lolololol
Depends on if they can split the ranges. I know of no spell in even Retail that had dual ranges depending on if it was helpful or harmful.
And I assure you, I have no reason to partake of narcotics/intoxication.
your a king for recognizing the power gap shockadin has in PVP and constantly refrencing it and making design descions based off it. Alot of people just ignore the power creep if you start buffing based off PVE alone
You should see the thread I created about boomkins…
Thanks
Maybe adding a dot to exorcism or a dot to holy shock that builds with each application would be good. Or make holy wrath no longer have a cd but instead a longer cast time so that the libram that juices holy wrath is even more valuable for shockadin. Allowing them to cast it regularly so long as they keep those crits rolling.
Adding another rune that gives the paladin a stacking buff with holy shock would be amazing. Perhaps increasing holy damage by 10% with each holy shock damaging cast and having it cap out at 5 stacks, and it lasts like 10 seconds.