Layering isn't enough; Starting Bottleneck Classic Vs Vanilla

[Hypêrspace-dalaran (Hypêrspace)]

/checks

nope

[Bananaynay-garrosh (Bananaynay)]

/shrug
then no?

[Hypêrspace-dalaran (Hypêrspace)]

k well i was trying to determine if it might apply to me since i was pretty much a nochanges person. not entirely, but pretty much. i thought guild banks would be good.

[Rözen-the-scryers (Rözen)]

Well we won’t all be trying to get onto one server. Also, I have a feeling like they are vastly underestimating how many realms to make.

[Threemini-staghelm]

The only way to duplicate the “vanilla experience” is to limit the maximum players to 300,000… about what vanilla started with.

The only way to simulate the vanilla experience is with layering sized to match the average server population. Doing the math of 300,000 players on 89 servers you get an average of 3,370 players… Divided into 6 starting zones: 561 people per starting zone.

If you set the cap for each layer pair to 3000, you will average 500 players per starting zone.

This closely approximates what happened in Vanilla… of course you had some servers more populated than others. But that too will happen naturally in Classic.

If you make it “convenient” to level out of the starting zones… you will just have the SAME congestion in the secondary zones.

The only thing that will address this is time. Peeps will play at launch and get a few levels then go to bed… while others stick at it. They will spread out naturally at that point.

[Brokenwind-malganis (Brokenwind)]

The purist in me is agaisnt decreasing spawn times, however, for starting zones it truly doesn’t matter does it. That’s a decent idea. Something needs to be done in the starting zone at minimum to address the tagging issue. Possibly in the secondary starting zones like Durotar, Elwynd, etc.

No. It is a typical server startup atmosphere. I too was there at the beginning. If you cannot handle the circus atmosphere of a server day 1, then plan to not log in on day 1.

No increased spawn rate, no dynamic spawns, no sharding.

[Brokenwind-malganis (Brokenwind)]

There’s no reason to settle for a disrupting bottleneck on the first few levels

Then do not play on day 1. Problem solved.
As long as there is low lag and no crashing, and as long as the login servers are not turning to as they have done in the past, then deal with it.

[Monkenpo-boulderfist]

Heya, that’s not fair! hehehehe

Come on now Brokenwind, tell me you actually want to spend hours on the first few quests! wouldn’t it be more fun to just quest normally and actually be progressing?

[Brokenwind-malganis (Brokenwind)]

Server openings are an event, this glut and competition is one of the things that makes it memorable. It is temporary, can be avoided by grouping and traveling, and to suggest that it needs a much hated mechanic so you personally can have a different experience gets a hard no from me, and likely a troll report as well. Do not suggest things that cheapen the experience for others.

[Teedo-jubeithos (Teedo)]

This post just has BFA written all over it

[Monkenpo-boulderfist]

BFA I did not play. Not to this very day. Only classic will come my way, and that’s all I really have to say.

[Studmuffyn-veknilash (Studmuffyn)]

BFA I did not play. Not to this very day. Only classic will come my way, and that’s all I really have to say.

Okay! I’m glad I heard that today! Yay!

[Rahven-blackrock]

I suppose there’s a reason OP doesn’t have any achievements younger than 2014. And that, as a day 1 WoW player, they have never done Wailing Caverns, Deadmines, Gnomer, SFK, etc. Which while possible is incredibly unlikely.

Of course OP has a new account, because they were banned/lost the pw/moms sisters boyfriend took the account.

I don’t care if people who didn’t play in Vanilla want to get into Classic. Hell, they’ll probably enjoy it more in a lot of cases because it’ll be something they haven’t experienced before.

However I don’t see the need to claim your a vet like the ‘street cred’ means anything. It just makes the post come off as disingenuous.

[Commodus-gorgonnash]

I’ve been playing since late vanilla, got my guy to 55 before BC launched after about 8 months of leveling. I agree with you. I have recently played on Lightshope and its insane how many people are on there wanting to play Classic just messing around. There are several really bad unplayable bottle necks that I do not remember being a problem in the game.

I think mob sharing and quest item drops to drop for everyone for bottle neck only quests would be a really good idea. Northshire for example, and the Fargo deep mine just after that. But I think after that it would be fine. Maybe the Jasperlode mine and maybe few other quests. (Ali perspective only, I don’t play Horde)

I realize it will be a circus, and that’s fun, but we can still implement a few things to help it not be an absolute nightmare.

[Swíft-boulderfist]

yep yep i agree. a bottleneck in the starting zone to spend an entire day there wasn’t my experience either.

Something has to be done. I saw some different suggestions from sharding entry zones to dynamic spawns at entry zones only, to more mob sharing and quest item drops in the first zones.

[Brokenwind-malganis (Brokenwind)]

@Swíft-boulderfist

Something has to be done. I saw some different suggestions from sharding entry zones to dynamic spawns at entry zones only, to more mob sharing and quest item drops in the first zones.

I too have seen a multitude of troll threads.

Here is the suggestion that gives “the most clarity”:

[Katerina-mannoroth]

However, after the stress test beta I see a need for something. My mind has changed, and something simple must be done to address the beginning bottleneck.

Unfortunately, during this stress test and the time afterwords, the starting areas and zone population were so immensely populated, it detracted from the overall fun of the experience. Just having 10-15 people run around with the boars made it difficult to tag any during this test. However, it was at least manageable. However, at times there were 50-100+.

Which is why some of us were fine with outright sharding at the launch of the game, just make sure each shard had a targeted population of several dozen players per “area”(several “areas” to a zone) and let them go at it. Sure people flitting in and out of existence would be annoying, but at least you(and they) could make progress. But nope, people asked for this, so they’re going to get it.

Now you get to worry about forming a 5 man group on launch, and still needing to sit around for a half-hour or more waiting for mobs to spawn/get the tag in order to finish a quest. It’s going to be quite the train wreck to watch unfold, both in and out of the game.

[Katerina-mannoroth]

There were far more people in the zone than you’ll see with Layering. This was the “no layering” test to see how well it could run without it. There were well more people than server cap in the game and it was stressed, but it proved that layering is necessary.

Layering was being used during the stress test. Asmongold’s stream(among others) highlights that. I was on a layer with C’thun, but after that crash, I wound up on a “boring” layer of Northshire Abbey that simply had Hogger Spawning while I could watch other streamers witnessing Golemag vs Bolvar Foredragon & Onyxia, or Ragnaros, or Thrall in Northshire killing lowbies.

[Katerina-mannoroth]

When the login servers get overloaded, the forums crash. Happened in '04, still happening in '19.

From 2004 through 2009, anytime more than one server crashed, the forums usually crashed not long after that. Considering the Stress Test likely involved a half-dozen realms worth of people at 2004 population levels, the forums bogging down is hardly shocking.

[Eloraell-moon-guard]

Well we won’t all be trying to get onto one server.

There will be more than enough people to make every server have at least 2-3 layers. 3000 across the server, vs 10,000 or 15,000 people?

Also, I have a feeling like they are vastly underestimating how many realms to make.

Which makes the numbers even higher. I hope they’re using realistic metrics to indicate when a server is going to be overpopulated after launch and adding new ones with haste.

The only way to simulate the vanilla experience is with layering sized to match the average server population. Doing the math of 300,000 players on 89 servers you get an average of 3,370 players… Divided into 6 starting zones: 561 people per starting zone.

Something that they don’t want to do because a) how do you choose 350,000, and b) if they added enough servers that all the tourists go onto 3k servers, you’d have 1000 dead servers in a month.

Layering was being used during the stress test. Asmongold’s stream(among others) highlights that. I was on a layer with C’thun, but after that crash, I wound up on a “boring” layer of Northshire Abbey that simply had Hogger Spawning while I could watch other streamers witnessing Golemag vs Bolvar Foredragon & Onyxia, or Ragnaros, or Thrall in Northshire killing lowbies.

Yeah, saw that after I made that post. It was however, heavily broken too.

From 2004 through 2009, anytime more than one server crashed, the forums usually crashed not long after that. Considering the Stress Test likely involved a half-dozen realms worth of people at 2004 population levels, the forums bogging down is hardly shocking.

Well… they have had 15 years to separate the forums from the login server. It crashes every expansion launch for the same reason.