This thread reeks of Garmuck.
That being said … I’m gonna need a source before I go believing a random sock puppet who is likely not even going to provide any follow up posts.
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Resilience was amazing, they should have enhanced and refined it rather than abandoning it.
fake edit: Also, resilience didn’t exist in classic wow so it couldn’t have killed classic wow.
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a Healer with Resilence is a tank. PLZ DONT Resilence
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Here we see the natural habitat of the 50 people who still play wotlk pvp.
i really liked resilience tbh
No they don’t.
The problem is it compartmentalizes the game and that is not good for an MMO.
People who gear through PvP should be nearly as effective in PvE content as people who gear through PvE content.
I also people who gear through PvE content should be nearly as effective at PvP as people who gear through PvP content.
What I dont want is to need to switch between my PvP resilience set to PvP and switch to my PvE set to do PvE content. The devs should balance the game around not needing resilience added to the game. Every ability has a PvP coefficient that can be adjusted. There is no need to add this stat to the game.
Also, resilience is completely immersion breaking. What is the point of killing the big epic monsters in huge raids, if you get completely destroyed in PvP because your enemy is decked out in resilience gear?
I disagree entirely. Doing content should not reward the ability to smash players, and vice versa.
They tried to do universal balancing and found it impossible, much like every other MMO that either wound up doing separate tracks or forcing standardized stats or even abilities in PvP, which tends to result in better balance.
In an ideal world, sure, you’d be correct, but the challenge it imposes is extreme and adds several dimensions to an already troubling logic puzzle that would ultimately result in homogenization across classes and abilities.
As for resilience being immersion breaking, that seems like a stretch and that’s coming from an avid RPer.
Didn’t participation in PvP drastically decrease in TBC onward after resilience was implemented? I don’t know what the reason actually was, but if resilience was a contributor and that most PvP’ers are indeed PvE’ers, then pro-resilience people may want to change their stance.
Some PvP is better than no PvP. I mean, we’ve seen how all this has played out in the past right? Now we’re arguing about the same thing.
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Recently rewatched the Dan Olson (Folding Ideas) video ‘World of Warcraft Classic and what we left behind’ and I think this debate is actually a pretty good illustration of the ideas in his essay. I cannot give it justice in one sentence, but the basic idea is that even if Vanilla Wow is tedious and inefficient, in a way it feels less like the game is telling you what to do… So even if everything is a grind, some people would prefer that because it’s less obvious you’re on a particular track or treadmill… Which is why the posts against resilience here remind me of that.
hopefully they don’t overtune it to the point crit means nothing and non-mana based classes are just simply superior because they can pump to infinity on 5-sunders.
As always, the devil’s in the details. While it may “feel better” in a very vague, general sense, once you get to the actual crunch, examine the incentive structures that have been created, and start litigating fairness, having full raid gear damage against players is outright bad for PvP with how the PvE system is designed.
did you do pvp and pve in tbc? Because I did as a priest, and having 300+ was a requirement in pvp or I would be killed in 2-3 hits. It was just dumb. People not wearing resilience gear were immediate targets in pvp battlegrounds and arenas because we knew they were an easy kill.
The gearing from pvp in classic 60 can be improved on a bit, and the damage coefficients can be scaled down for PvP, so there is no need to introduce a new pvp stat to the game.
Damage coefficients being adjusted for PvP is resilience by another form. I would find that preferable to just doing full raid gear damage, but I don’t mind PvP being required to get better PvP gear the same way raiding is required to get better raid gear on the face of it.
I was just starting to cut my teeth as a decent player in TBC, but I was still very much a kid. Lots of fond memories going deep AFF over SL/SL specifically to spite rogues.
If I had to idealize a PvP system, though, it would be standardization of stats across the board that can be adjusted agnostic of gearing or statting for PvE, with PvP rewarding unique vanity items and the like, and recipes for the PvP specific items like bandages and pots.
Part of the purpose of having a PvP gear track, I believe, was to offer PvPers the ability to play the game as they wanted to, as many have little or no interest in raiding, and offer them a system for progression.
Oh certainly Vanilla is not optimal for competitive PvP or even competitive PvE arguably. But I don’t think it’s unbelievable that there are some people who enjoy it that way because what they are looking for is different than what you enjoy.
For games not liking it is literally the best argument you can have.
Omg bring on the resil please. I dont’t want to pve to pvp.
PvP gear already exists in classic 60 and will also be much easier to attain since your ranks do not decay. There is no need to have resilience in the game.
Theres nothing wrong with it but theres definitely something wrong with heals being able to have full benefits of their healing power 
But no ine can explain why its bad for the game.
If you prefer touching someone and they implode into a cloud of dust, just say that.