I have two questions, and the answers seem pretty obvious to me, but I wanted to probe the forums and see what the consensus is:
Is “Undead” a race or a state of being?
Was the Lich King (Arthas) human? If not, when exactly did he stop being human, and what did he become?
‘Undead’ is a state of being. You can’t be undead without first being alive, and being alive isn’t a race. People would probably be able to successfully argue that it is a race, since one’s race can change (see the 150 offshoots of trolls)… but you’d still be an undead human, orc, turtle, or whathaveyou.
Arthas is an undead human. I think that it is generally accepted that he became undead when he tore his heart out, but happy to be corrected on this.
Yes.
/10char
Corporeal Undeath is a state of having your soul imperfectly anchored to your corpse.
Arthas was undead, but was a sort of unique undead as he just sort of transitioned from alive to undead, with dead kinda just a momentary blip in between.
Arthas was not dead, so he wasn’t an Undead. He never has been physically killed nor has been raised before we killed him in Northrend. If you want a confirmation of that, you can watch the Afterlives: Bastion cinematic from retail who explain what happened to Arthas soul after he died. Unlike undeads, his soul was whole and intact at the moment of his death.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNSnOAumlB8
Yes he was. Frostmourne killed him. That’s word of god.
That’s your fantasy, but as we see in his death cinematic, he’s still human. The helm lose it’s control over him. He’s probably not in a good shape at all, but he’s alive,
But then why is he listed as “undead” in game?
The dude cut out his own heart.
You know, one of the bodies MAJOR organs?
Good luck cutting out your own heart and see if you stay alive.
https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Arthas_Menethil#Notes_and_trivia
Well, ok, i missed that. This is awkward. My bad, then. XD
I’d say Undead is a state of being, considering that the many “types” of Undead can definitely be referred to as “races” by WoW standards (regular Undead Humans, Kvaldir, Ghouls, Banshees, Abominations…), meaning groups of individuals who share specific physical and biological traits
The only ones not fitting that definition would be the Kul Tirans I guess, since it’s been established that they really are regular Humans and that they differ from the mainland Humans only in culture (lorewise)
Not to sound all “SJW/woke,” but Race is one of those words that can have different meanings and personal identifications. In real life and in fiction.
What does being a “race” mean, and in what context?
In WoW, Void Elves are a race, and they were Blood Elves very recently, and High Elves before that. Forget evolution over generations - in WoW, one’s race can change throughout the course of one’s life! Several times!
How can I put this delicately, without sounding like Jill Biden discussing tacos… but if we are talking about race/ethnicity, “Undeath” as a racial classification in WoW reminds me of the IRL classification “Hispanic” - in that you can be a Hispanic White or a Non Hispanic White. And a Hispanic Black or a Non Hispanic Black. A person being Hispanic can also be various Races.
Zoe Saldana is both both hispanic and black.
Cameron Diaz is both hispanic and white.
With that in mind, an Undead Tauren is Undead and also still a Tauren.
I think Arthas stopped being human, and alive, the moment he tore out his frozen heart. Argueably, he could have also stopped being alive and human when he picked up Forstmorne because it literally ate his soul. Being heartless and souless is being no better than dead, it’s not human anyway.
Undeath is a state of being. It’s the state of having your soul put back in a dead body. Which does support the idea that Life is only contingent on having a soul. I think that is perfectly emphasized by the Automa.
Arthas essentially stopped being Mortal or Alive when 1)He took up Frostmourne 2)Tore out his frozen heart and 3)Became the Lich King. He was essentially a undead Demi god at the height of his power.
Because of gameplay needs? Necromancers in Warcraft 3 were all undead but lorewise were not actually dead.
Both. The word race does not mean anything as specific as anyone tells you it does. It is the vaguest of vague classifications. That’s why it’s used instead of species, a term that is a bit more specific and in certain ways contradictory to how the various races are depicted in WoW. (Ex: Different species are not usually supposed to be able to procreate and create healthy, fully functional offspring together.)
They’re named "un"dead, not unalive. Weird as it may sound, undead are not technically dead. They’re just in a state that could be described as an unholy mockery of true life.
As a note undeath is simply a state of being neither alive nor dead. Someone undead would be stuck in between both states. Hence why we label them undead.
Hope that clears things up a bit some here.
The terms are not exclusive.
The majority of Forsaken are undead humans.
I think the difference is also that playable forsaken are basically ghouls who regained sapience, at least in portrayals. So a specific type of undead, formerly human, briefly mind-controlled to the point of mindlessness, etc.
DKs, Banshees, and so on had a different origin.
I would say he stopped being alive very soon after he got Frostmorne, as he wandered unprotected in the tundra for awhile. He would of frozen to death.