Remember in legion? gear didnt matter this much because of templates.
then everybody cried like babies.
now they removed templates and made some super OP gear.
now everybody is crying about the gear.
just lol.
brutal circle of life tbh.
8 Likes
No, personally i didn’t like templates due to lack of customization mattering in pvp. I wanted my gear i got to matter.
Now let’s be honestly here there are a few times that need to be fixed. CoS gear and tank trinkets. Those items fixed would fixed a lot of complaints about gear in pvp.
Classes design is a whole other issue that templetes can’t fix.
2 Likes
Gear SHOULD matter. But it should be PvP gear, with a guaranteed way to earn the gear (vendors). Not PvE gear. Sick of hearing this.
20 Likes
If the tournament rules show us anything it’s that melee are extremely weak right now without CoS gear or Prism, and adjusting survivability for melee is a double edged sword. If they go to far melee will be unstoppable, not far enough and they are still terrible if CoS gear + trinkets are disabled.
The real menace, and something I see the most frequently, is Void Stone. It absorbs so much damage that it completely changes the game versus teams that don’t have one. Even encountered a DK/WW/MW last night at 2500+ mmr that we’re running 2 Void Stones. It’s extremely toxic and frustrating to have a win taken away with 1 button.
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The issue is they decided completely on their own that having two different gear sets for PvE and PvP wasn’t good for the game. This was never something I saw many complaints about, but it’s what has created the current situation and there’s no way out of it unless they revert that stance or add templates back.
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You can get a void stone from lfr… it’s not like it’s a huge barrier to get and even the 380ilvl version still absorbs over 100k (although I agree it should just be banned from arenas)
But still, more on topic, just allow people to die again. There’s absolutely no reason a mage should be able to cast a poly (or anything) while facetanking 2 melee. Locks shouldn’t be able to just plant themselves mid and turret chaos bolts. I think survivability is alright, but when lock teams can go to 90% dampening and rmpala are the only comp with huge go’s every 30s, obviously eventually a melee cleaves is going to go down. As it stands now only healers need peels or need to kite, and it’s dumb
Haha I tried CoS on LFR and it’s a disaster. Our Druid tank actually said “I have to do mechanics? Usually I just stand and face tank all raid. What do I do?”
Also no one was ranged tanking the other boss. I left after 2 attempts and adds don’t even spawn on LFR lol.
I still haven’t gotten it from LFR.
I guess it’s not a huge barrier if the RNG gods favor you.
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As much as I hated everything else about WoD, the gearing system was ideal then I think. Base level competitive gear could be farmed easily on a new toon and it was better than PvE gear, meanwhile PvE was far better in PvE.
Both functional in both environments, but each one had an upper hand in it’s own respective aspect.
Great so I have to PvE to PvP STILL. That doesnt solve the problem at all.
Agreed. This is for both Melee, Ranged, and Heals. Self healing needs to be nerfed to the ground. I understand wanting to be able to heal while leveling without bandages, but make everyones self heal out of combat and pops you out of stealth. Its ridiculous when a hunter, DH, fury war, etc the list goes on out heal hybrid casted heals. FFS Fury wars heal on charge…
I agree, but theres a larger design issue here. First off melee have way too much uptime and gap closers. You virtually have to make casters be able to face tank because of that. Youre only other options are to remove gap closers and/or add gap openers. Its World of Meleecraft. They need to really look at class design and give it so ranged has time to actually cast in this game when they have space, give them the abilities to create that space, then punish them hard when melee is on them. Its not fun to be a ranged class thats “tanky” and just cast in the face of melee.
I dont think theres anyone left in the pvp dev team to give us “payback” they are all working the new overwatch content / event now.
Doing pve to have an advantage in pvp isn’t exactly new though, that’s been a thing since arenas have existed. The amount of advantage you get now is cause for concern, and the type of advantage is complete aids. Before you just used to do more damage (and take more since you were probably sacrificing reslience) and games would end quicker, which sucked but didn’t feel nearly as bad
But I agree completely with everything else you said, this xpac is more or less a wash due to really bad class design choices.
3 Likes
Lol pretty much. Such a dumb statement that I’m also tired of hearing. Templates were better than this garbage but that’s only because this garbage is just that bad.
Please take a look at wod PvP gearing op and get back to us about templates lol. Even in mop/cata the PvP gear was still mostly bis in PvP. Sure there some slightly better pve gear options but nothing in comparison to void stone or the tank trinkets pre nerf. Or RNG gearing.
Seriously the only reason templates look half decent is because bfa is that much of a hot steaming pile.
Honestly Arena should just be a small mini game where you get to pick your class, talents, everyone is given same gear and its all an even playing field so you guys can stop whining about it.
Legion was also the expansion where they completely gutted class design, amputating all our classes. But at the least they provided a prosthetic in the form of our Artifact Weapon.
Now they’ve taken away our prosthesis. And haven’t adjusted class design too much. Kind of a “walk it off” approach to amputees.
This - so much of this. This is why they disable things on the tourney realm, such as CoS gear. PVP has always been a “mini game”. Gear shouldn’t matter in it - else you can never balance it. Wow has way too many specs and classes. Combine that with this god awful azerite system - yeesh.
Legion, for a person who primarily pvp’d, was great when they got the templates right and it let me be more casual in my playtime, while still being competitive. Granted it took them a while to get there, but this whole xpac feels like 10 steps back just to appease people screaming about “omg customizations”.
Resilience was trash when you’re a fresh max level stepping into a battleground you might as well just lay down and bite the curb yourself because you’re going to get stomped regardless of what you do.
I think resilience was the best system. It made pvp gear better for pvp and vice versa, but both types of gear could perform to some extent in other content. Who cares if you suck in battlegrounds the first day you hit max level, lol
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A person who’s new to the game cares? If you’re absolutely getting trashed no matter what you do why play the game? Even a person coming from pve it’s not like it just affects battlegrounds it affects rated arena too. The only instance where coming from pve is a good thing is when you clear max content every week and have bis in everything so you can one shot people. Examples: Shadowmourne AP stacking warriors
This, bring back vendors with WoTLK gearing system including resil. easy fix.