Is the Tedrassil tragedy being differently than the one in Theramore

Lore Story Forum
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Grace à Zahir from the SF discord, I am making this topic:

“Teldrassil is treated completely differently from how it was treated after Theramore. MOP was essentially about the consequences of Theramore and especially Jaina, the night elves don’t really get this treatment, and they are also deprived of the focus to be in issues that belong to them.”-Zahir

Do people agree/disagree with it? My answer(and mostly because I dont want to type it, I’m just copy it), I dont think that was ever true. Look after Tides of War Jaina feel off the map and we were all focused on the war/pandaria. In fact I dont recall any mention of Theramore until we got back to Jaina in The Purge. After said purge Jaina did get some screentime in Thunder king patch but that was so she would end up making a small amount of peace with the Horde. 5.2 rolls in, she is largely absent again and only show up during the 5.3 at the end of the raid.

Both the destruction of Theramore and Tedrassil as far as the game is concern and the Pandaria Campaign/Blood War is concerned were impetus of there respective war. But they did both sort of fade somewhat to the background. If anything Tedrassil destruction was always more in your face to the Alliance. Even now you are force to see all the night elven refuges in Stormwind. Theramore never got that treatment. Heck, aside from Jaina(and maybe Vereesa due to her husband) no one talked often about Theramore.

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I will argue they learned their mistake with Theramore to make it much more obvious that this is a bad thing that happened. That’s why you see refugees from Teldrassil when you didn’t see anything after Theramore.

So yes, Teldrassil is being treated treated different from Theramore, insomuch that they (at least tried) to make it look like a tragic event that effected the entire Alliance. However, like Theramore, because it’s a tragedy that effects one person (or group), but then the focus goes to an entirely different group of people, the effort is lost.

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Presumably simce Theramore was mainly human, the few survivors would simply assimilate with the rest of the Humans in Stormwind.

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Have you see the real world? Just because they are the same race does not mean they would suddenly not be living off the streets. Especially considering Stormwind just had it own housing crisis in Cata.

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Honestly, both were handled poorly, for opposite reasons.

Theramore failed to capitalize on the humanity of the tragedy. It quickly became a story about Jaina, and Jaina alone. Some of the civilian survivors were only seen once, in passing, in SoO. And people like Kinndy were merely footnotes about how sad Jaina was.

Teldrassil drew heavily on the humanity of its tragedy, with a novella and questline dedicated to the deaths of the trapped civilians, and Night Elven refugees being placed in the game in Stormwind. But they’ve just abruptly dropped Tyrande, claimed her vengeance is done, and gave her little development beyond a new Elunite ritual and a makeover.

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I agree that Theramore seems to be given a power that Teldrassil is lacking.

My theory:

Theramore was an Orc (Garrosh) being mean to a Human (Jaina), so that event had the writer’s attention, and it had a proper story.

Meanwhile, Teldrassil was an Elf being mean to Elves.

Teldrassil only serves the Human characters and their Orc pets, while throwing the rest of the Horde and the Night Elves under the bus to push this Orc+Human story.

It almost seems as if Blizzard completely misjudged what the fan reaction towards Teldrassil would be. And then they wrote the story as an episodic yet loosely tied collection of non sequiturs.

Teldrassil happened. People are mad and sad… but other stuff is happening… and the people who should be the most mad and sad (Night Elves) are given very little screen time.

However, when it comes to Theramore, we are still reminded of it everytime we see Jaina’s ugly mug. We see that mug constantly in BfA. Everytime I load into Kul Tiras, or zoned into BoD, or even now in EP, there she is, with her Theramore Dye job in full display.

And Vareesa is moping about because Theramore. When we see her being sad, its rooted in Theramore, where Rhonin was killed.

Teldrassil seems more like a tool to give the Horde the villain bat while making Jaina, Genn, and Anduin seem righteous. It does not ring true to me. It seems wholly contrived with hamfisted logic.

Theramore’s destruction was the goal from the start and it was accomplished. We saw that happen. It was an event with obvious build up and consequences we see to this day.

Teldrassil sort of happened on the fly, where even Nathanos was shocked. In fact, even Sylvanas seems to surprise herself. The first thing she says to the Horde player is: “I could not have foreseen this out come.”

Really, witch?

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Gee, Blizzard using a tragedy to show how it only makes one character sad? I’m glad they never did that again!

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Don’t forget that segment in the prison break scenario before the Horde player goes to Zandalar when you have to run from Jaina and she has the “Ashes of Theramore” buff while she’s doing her Arthas impression.

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If I recall Theramore was not that big of a deal either at the time.
It sort of just happened and we moved on with the story.

It was only later, over time, with various appearances, cinematics and interactions did Theramore become what we know it as.
We can only hope that Teldrassil will never stop being referenced and various characters’ reaction to it. This event should never be restricted to a single expansion, it should follow the Horde, its characters and races for a long, long time.
Every time a Horde character speaks this tragedy has to be thrown in their face going forward.

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Yeah they make a more big deal with Theramoore than it really was. Teldrassil should be treated with more spotlight but I think they know they pissed a lot of people and are trying to sweep it under the rug, just like all the times trolls were massacred, Taraujo, South Shore and others calamities.

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Credit to the old team, at least Jaina wasn’t Kinndy’s enemy that was moments ago actively trying to kill her.

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i mean, if you think about it theramore happened to give jaina a story.

so is easy to see why the tragedy is handled differently.
it was all how it affected the main character that is now changing the story in kultiras and azeroth.

if that didn’t happened, where would jaina story go without arthas? be always a background leader that does nothing despite the fact that she basically founded the current alliance and was a key member to bring nelfs and draenie?

her white hair and herself is basically a reminder of it.

While teldrassil is different because i don’t think that will affect just one character but rather, and entire playable races AND his character.

And to be fair, we don’t really know where that is going, while with jaina’s arc, i feel like it’s almost over now she being leader of kultiras.
six years layer from the deed.

they surely taken their time.

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They really didn’t anything with Theramoore in the long run, only have her changes of mood that seems bordeline bipolar. Having her becoming more war-like because the world itself demands it in orden to survive would had been a much better deveploment.

Also yeah Blizzard screwed some characters with killing off important ones like Arthas early. I would love to see a batman/joker like relationship betwen Lk Arthas and Jaina

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So, which one is batman and which one is Joker?

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Hum, yes they did. they did it all for her character, they even created a new character in the book just to be killed that would push more the main.

just think about this, if that didn’t happened, she would be still be leader of theramore, rhonin would still be alive, the purge would never happened and the blood elves would be now alliance.

and rhonin would probably have the role that khadgar now has.

The story of the alliance in kultiras would be much more different and to be honest (at least for me) not interesting, about someone seeking redemption with her nation and family we would have a much more different story.
and i don’t know how this would have affected the faction war, to be honest.

And blizzard is surely planning something with derek in the future.

isn’t this a horde theme? i mean, wasn’t that what garrosh was?

yep i agree, not only her, but also with someone like sylvanas, arthas was everything for her, what would have happened to sylvanas if arthas stayed for a little longer?
well i guess thats for another topic.

As for teldrassil, we still don’t know exactly how is going to end and how is going to affect nelfs and their characters, while the other story arc is pretty much coming to an end.

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She had thought that the outcome would have been a dead Malfurion and Anduin held in checkmate as she originally laid out. Assuming at least some truth to her original planning session with Saurfang and the later one with the Champion.

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I think he is wrong, teld was giving more weight and power than theramore, theramore was only mentioned by jaina while teld is mentioned by multple characters and giving a whole patch around the nelves getting a bit of revenge and dealing a blow to sylvanas for what she did.

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Sylvanas did not originally lay out Malfurion being dead:

    Sylvanas’s eyes disappeared beneath the edge of her hood. “They lost their nation years ago. The Gilneans will be furious if the Alliance acts to help the kaldorei first,” she said. “The boy in Stormwind will have a political crisis on his hands. He is smart, but he is not experienced. What happens when Genn Greymane, Malfurion Stormrage, and Tyrande Whisperwind all demand differing actions? He is not a high king like his father. The respect the others give him is a courtesy, not an obligation. Anduin Wrynn will rapidly become a leader who cannot act. If the Alliance will not march as one, each nation will act in its own interest. Each army will return home to protect their lands from us.”
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Theramore was treated differently because Horde players could still justify to themselves that they totally deserved it because of the war that was both going on and wasn’t going on at the same time. That’s harder to do with Teldrassil.

Talk about high standards.

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Teldrassil is being treated differently because of how much worse it was than Theramore, while still having the tacit approval of the Horde populace. They went way too far in their quest for ‘metal’ and shocking moments, to have a big badass scene of carnage, before realizing that it basically damned the Horde to being a villainous faction.

Remember, the writers have a different view on what makes a race cool, it seems, than the rest of us. Orcs being retconned into bloodthirsty conquerors even without demon influence, Forsaken mass using Blight and then forcibly raising their victims en masse, and so on. Their vision of the Horde are the big tough jocks who run the school, while the Alliance are the sissy white knight nerds. They push the boundaries of what the Horde can do and get away with, but then need to double back and make things so that there’s no consequences for it.

Did orcs get comeuppance for Theramore? Did undead get payback for Gilneas and Southshore? No, the retaliation at the hands of Jaina was against blood elves, of all races. Undercity? Blighted, yes, but fully evacced, the undead no doubt have a way to clear the Blight out eventually, the entire infastructure is intact. And what was framed as the payback for that? The Alliance goes after the Zandalari, kill their king and… leave. Orcs, Forsaken, and Humans? Unscathed, essentially.

This is why it’s being treated differently. The writers by and large all play Horde, and they wanted a big got’em moment against the Alliance. They favour Orcs and Forsaken, maybe Goblins, but Teldrassil and even Darkshore makes it impossible for them to frame it as an equitable morality between the two factions. So Teldrassil is being swept under the rug while Theramore isn’t, because Theramore is ‘safer’.

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