Is khadgar paralyzed from the waist down or just recovering?

Lore Story Forum
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No they weren’t. Gilneas was not part of the Alliance at that time. It was an independent nation. Gilneas joined the Alliance after the Forsaken attacked them.

This is a perfect example of why I said it is a waste of time to discuss this. You are already trying to add additional caveats. Why did you pick 8 years? My guess is to dodge Varian’s death. Or maybe to dodge WoD, as I had already off handedly mentioned a death there. The actual reason for 8 doesn’t really matter. It just shows intent to brush things off. I have been down this path with people before. It is all the same thing. If I start listing to many deaths you will just move the goal post. It will be a different time limitation. Or that you don’t think they were important enough. Etc., etc. It is all just a changing rules.

And if you want to try and tally count, how about this: How many Horde cities has the Alliance completely destroyed? How many Horde population centers have been completely wiped off the map? But we already know how you will answer that. It wont count, or is not as big of a deal as character death.

You can try to play the pointless tit for tat game. Or you can grow up, admit the Horde is not the victim faction and that there are legitimate complaints on both sides. And that the extreme all or nothing narratives are all false.

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they were still at war. Again attacking a leader is declaration of war and this point faction war should of started and alliance should of been the aggressors. But this was never mentioned in game again. This is what I mean when I say alliance gets white washed.

Did you forget Voljin? or garrosh who his counter part. He didn’t get hoeric death but was villain batted then killed off?

WOD was one of the worst things to happen to horde lore. It went from orcs were bad because of demon manipulation to nah they would still do that regardless. You literally fight past horde characters.

no it is not, even then do you a count over all if it helps. It just blows my mind how people like you hand on to stuff that happen a decade ago. Very well do it make a list.

sure make that list, also add how many cities horde has versus alliance. How many times horde cities were raided/sacked and attacked by the alliance.

I agree both side have complaints. But it not even close, horde as a faction has been absent outside of faction conflict for close to a decade. Even in the most leaning horde expansions, alliance quested under alliance characters and no where was there a time where alliance leader or characters were mia or plain not doing anything like the horde in the last decade.

Be a little honest here, horde is a horrible place. This tit for tat your the one who started it, kind of weird to tell someone else to grow up. It’s character roaster is slim, it is not very active in the last decade outside of faction conflict. Even in faction conflict, it is villain batted. It’s leaders have been turned into villain or just killed off. I can’t recall a heroic moment horde has even when it’s characters die. Point to Varian’s death, what we get is stuff like Voljin’s death.

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No likes on a post that speaks the truth?
Though I will say Horde characters end up dead far too often. Our current batch of leaders are the “literally who” brigade.

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See, this is what I mean about applying different rules.

Gilneas was not at war with the Horde. Gilneas was not at war with the Forsaken. Sylvanas and the Forsaken attacked and tried to kill the king. And you mark that as okay. Sylvanas faced no repercussions for that unprovoked attack. An attack that wiped out a large portion of the Gilnean people and killed the king’s son.

Meanwhile, Greymane’s attack on Sylvanas stopped her from enslaving Eyir. That was it, that was the impact of Greymane’s actions. He did not wipe out a huge swath of Forsaken. But, in your mind that is a terrible attack Greymane should have faced consequences for.

You have a real goose/gander issue.

And here is the ‘it doesn’t really count because’ part that I knew was going to happen.

I could say ‘it blows my mind how people like you hang on to stuff from over 5 years ago’ just as easily.

And I was not hanging onto anything. I was pointing out how you change the rules.

Quantifiably not true.

But, even if it was (again, it isn’t) most of the story in the last decade has been either the faction conflict directly or strongly tied to it. And over the last decade the Horde has gotten more development time and more content released for it than the Alliance.

And we have the gaslighting attempt. Go back to my posts I have repeatedly said it was pointless to get into it. Got back to your posts and you have repeatedly asked for it.

And this shows how your preconceived notions are clouding your memory. Or did you think Saurfang did not have a heroic moment? And that was pretty recent. In fact I would argue it is the most recent big heroic moment in the game.

Saurfang’s death is the most comparable death to Varian’s. Both walked into death to save others lives. Both faced a foe they knew they could not win against. Both fought to the very end and held their head high.

Your obsession with being the victim is blinding you to much of the game.

I think a lot of that has to do with how much of past Horde story telling has been fixated on specific characters. Even when both the Horde and Alliance got equal time it tended to be a case of the Alliance story being spread out and the Horde focused on only a couple or few characters.

One of my biggest complaints about the Forsaken for years was they were basically nothing more than minions for telling Sylvanas story. The Forsaken got a lot of story time. But it was basically all Sylvanas story time. So, now that she is gone (at least for a little while) it feels like there really isn’t any Forsaken culture there.

There are a number of Horde characters that it feels like they took all of the story bandwidth. So, take even a couple out of the picture and it feels empty.

On the hopeful side:
Blizzard has been leaning heavily into the new generation taking over themes. It looks like they are trying to build the next generation of leaders. Whether from deaths, retirement, their city being nuked, etc. old leaders are stepping out of the picture. The Earthen story is also heavily littered with that theme. So, I expect this expac and the following ones will be heavily about setting up that new roster.

That likely means we are going to see an investment in the next gen leaders of the Horde, answering the ‘who’ part of the question. And next big content patch is likely to be heavily or completely Horde focused. So, might be getting some of those who questions answered.

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Maybe Khadgar will pull out a prequel Yoda.I imagine He is able to move with magic but probably tires him a lot faster so he will use the wheelchair to move around but when he needs to, he can just fight on foot.

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Dude A your the one changing context, yes Sylvanas started the war with Genn and it state as such in lore. Point is when Genn did it, it is never stated that he started the a war, and even in game it is never mentioned again.

You are the one who wants to go back a decade to make a point, fine create the list and lets see. Point it alot more horde characters died, there are alot less horde characters. Horde as a faction gets alot less screen time, especially in the last decade.

Flip flop between things all you want this is a fact.

He had no idea she was doing that, he attacked her to attack her. Point is he and the alliance faced no consequences. Forget that it is never even brought up.

Again alot more horde characters have died, lets make a list. This was point b, saying ya he died but his counter part vojin died to a no name mob. I guess you refuse to see that, but fine.

:clap: horde has lost alot more characters, you can’t name one alliance and say ya we lost just like you.

I stated horde as a faction is in a bad shape right now, i never said it was as bad when wow came out. the fact is you have to go back a decade to even say. Hey look it happened to us at one point, even then it wasn’t as bad

This is just plain false, horde has never gotten more development time nor more content than the alliance. You can look at screen time, characters, cities netrual content. This is just objectively false.

I am stating facts, you change the goal post when it suits you and try to call me out for me.

So I want the faction I play to have content, and positive development as it has not had that for most of the last decade. This some how equals me playing victim.

Learn to be objective, in the last decade horde hasn’t gotten much development out side of faction conflict. It has lost multiple characters, they also have not been replaced. It is to the point where alliance characters control all of the major questing and narrative.

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So, why should he face consequences and she shouldn’t?

Do you know how many skirmishes there were even before Garrosh started a war that didn’t end up a war? Heck, in Icecrown the Horde ambushed and wiped out an Alliance force. No war. Genn caused less damage to Sylvanas than that. Even battlegrounds were instances of conflict that didn’t spread into full war.

You are fixated on one instance and ignoring the rest to justify your victim narrative.

That is just not true. He knew exactly what she was doing and why. That is why he stole the lantern in the fight. That is why he said he was taking her future because he knew she intended to use and enslaved Eyir to raise new Forsaken.

Speaking of flip flopping. You just did it in the space of a couple paragraphs.

Sylvanas wiped out much of the Gilnean population, plagued their lands, tried to kill their king, and did kill the heir. She faced no consequences, and you think that is how it should be.

Genn had a fight with her where he stopped her from enslaving Eyir. And you think he, and the Alliance, should have faced consequences.

Double standard.

Back to the tit for tat I see.

And I wouldn’t call them direct counters. Horde and Alliance are different and everything should not, and was not mirrored. There was no mirror when Theramore was destroyed. No Horde city wiped off the map. There were not mirror Horde losses to the named NPCs there. Marcus Jonathon did not have a mirror killed on the Horde side.

There was no mirrors for the Alliance killed in Ashenvale and Darkshore. The Horde didn’t lose a city full of civilians as a mirror.

Etc., etc.

I really don’t understand how people like you can complain any time there is a Horde loss and the Alliance doesn’t lose sometime at the same time but be okay with an the Alliance losing things and the Horde not having a mirrored loss.

Just straight lies. BfA was not a decade ago. Ashenvale and Darkshore loses were not a decade ago. The complete destruction of a Teldrassil and all the people inside was not a decade ago.

Yes they have. Objectively they have. Cata was VASTLY more time on Horde. Heck, they even cut and pasted Horde questing to the Alliance because there wasn’t enough Alliance story. MoP had and entire patch that was only Horde story and Horde had more scenarios. BfA was blatantly more Horde story, including all the dev time and resources spent on the Saurfang story and cinematics.

But it is likely a waste of time because all you will do is say how that doesn’t count.

No you are not.

You have repeatedly asked for lists of deaths so you could match with Horde.
I have repeatedly said that is a waste of time because I have been down that road and the rules always change
You even proved me correct.

It has always been you asking for the tit for tat. You claiming it was me is nothing more than trying to gaslight.

You REALLY need to take your own advice here.

In the last decade neither faction has gotten much outside of the faction war. What has been done outside that is fairly close. But including the faction war the Horde got considerably more. Which is why I suspect you keep wanting to disqualify it.

You are missing so much of the game if you think that is true. So, VERY much. That or you are just so blinded by your bias you can’t tell what is actually going on.

You are hopeless.

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Ya but I would say attacking a leader is a different thing.

No he didn’t this was confirmed by blizzard.

Here we go let’s bring up stuff from 14 years ago and forget that the horde sat out legion, SL and now war within. Hey atleast your faction had its own questing in those expansion. Versus horde was absent in much of what I mentioned. Heck in cata alliance entire zone dedicated to night elf’s that both sides quested though.

Ya your on something

But you do you, it’s pointless arguing with you. I’m confident you’re either slow or it’s hard for you to comprehend things objectively. I’m sure you are one of those people who also think horde has equal representation this expansion.

You live in a different world.

30

I listed multiple expacs as examples, including BfA which was not 14 years ago. But it is nice how you try to portray something different.

Thanks for providing a nice example of how you just find some reason to disregard any evidence you don’t like.

And here is is both a good example of just straight false statements.

Legion had 7 zones.
Azsuna: Neither faction had any notable story.
Val’sharah: Both present, but leaned pretty Alliance.
Highmountain: Heavily Horde
Stormheim: Equal Horde and Alliance
Broken Shore: Equal
Suramar: Horde story
Argus: Mostly Alliance

Overall pretty comparable.

SL had very little faction story.

Most of what was there was in Ardeanweald. Which was split pretty equally between factions. I am guessing you missed the Bwomsamdi and Tauren story there. Maybe you should go check that out.

Beyond that there was a lot revealed for the Forsaken and their history in Maldraxxas. With little to no Alliance presence there. Even Bastion had a bit for the Forsaken with Uther (from Lordaeron home of the Forsaken).

Even Revendreth which had hardly any faction stuff had connections to both the Blood Elves (Kael’thas) and Garrosh.

But, let me guess: You don’t think any of that counts because…reasons.

This is pretty much the pattern for people like you. You make blanket, demonstrably false statements, then when evidence is produced you will say it doesn’t count so you can continue the false narrative. Go ahead, invent a reason.

And regarding TWW. The Horde was hardly present in the FIRST PATCH. That is all we have.

And notably, Blizzard has promised the content will be balanced between factions. Something they have said no to in the past when asked about imbalance in content.* So there is every reason to believe it will be. So, stop trying to play the victim over it.

*Note: In both the extra Horde only patch in MoP and the extra cinematics and quest lines in BfA players asked Blizzard if they were going to release Alliance content to balance it and they said no both time. If they can and are willing to say no, then when they say yes they will, chances are they intend to balance the content.

So:

Not YET. The expac just started. Blizzard promised Horde will be getting content. And if you are even paying a little attention to clues in game and in data mining, the next patch is likely going to be heavily, if not entirely, Horde story. So, the first patch is not equal. BUT IT IS ONLY THE FIRST PATCH.

And, like I mentioned. Blizzard has proven they can and will say no when they do not intend to balance the content. There is every reason to believe Horde will get comparable content.

So, I am done with you. Feel free to rant about how something doesn’t count because you think it was to long ago, you thought it was bad, didn’t have a giant ‘This is Horde’ sign flashing over it, etc., etc. You will just prove the point.

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You are everything you’re accusing others of being, holy cow. Is this Smallioz?

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I think it’s more likely than not that Khadgar is permanently paralyzed from the waist down. Blizzard’s been focusing on disability inclusion a bit lately, and adding Khadgar as disability representation would not be terribly surprising, so I do think he’s going to rely on a magic wheelchair for the rest of his life.

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I don’t know. Was Anduin crippled by Garrosh beating him against the bell or was he just recovering?

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Gilneas was not in the Alliance at the time, so Sylvanas attacking Gilneas was not an attack on the Alliance.

However, Genn’s attack on the Warchief of the Horde at Stormheim involved using Alliance assets against the Horde - not just Gilnean assets.

You helpfully invalidate your own argument a few posts later :

And that is the difference.

When Sylvanas and the Horde invade Gilneas, it wasn’t an attack on the Alliance, because they were not part of the Alliance yet.

However, Genn directly assaulted the Horde using Alliance assets.

1 Like
35

Are you being intentionally dense?

He said Genn should have faced consequences for attacking the head of another country that he was not currently at war with.

Sylvanas attacked the head of another country she was not at war with and killed his son AND wiped out a large portion of his people. And she didn’t face consequences.

The fact Gilneas was not part of the Alliance and so an attack on it could not have been part of the War Garrosh started means Sylvanas did WORSE than Genn and did not face consequences. So, calling for Genn to face consequences while excusing Sylvanas is hypocrisy.

It was an attack on a sovereign nation without provocation. And it was worse than what Genn did to her.

So, again: If Genn should face consequences for attacking Sylvanas, Sylvanas should have faced even more consequences for her attack on Genn and his people. Any call for Genn to be punished while excusing Sylvanas is hypocritical.