Heck, if they really have to add new stuff, new specs to existing classes - or just new classes outright, is a way better way to add variety.
Yeah, there’s balance concerns - but there are with these borrowed power systems as well. 
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more then likely going to still be awful likely rely too heavily of so called “legendaries” that really are not Legendary to begin with if everyone else using it cause it mandatory.
to me they just need to stop adding these damn “borrowed” power systems like corruptions, Legion leggo’s, etc… that stuff aint fun and the way they bake it into the story is so damn sloppy
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Yep. They are revolving the game around LAME COVENANT ABILITIES…blizzard gonna kill shadowlands
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BfA isnt meant to be played without azerite gear. Thats like saying “Try playing without half your spellbook and let us know how fun it is.” or “Try playing Legion without your artifact weapon and let us know how fun it is.” or “Try playing SL without covenants and soul-binds and let us know how fun it is.” Obviously, any of these scenarios are going to feel terrible because youre playing the game with one hand tied behind your back. All these arguments about how bad borrowed power is are missing the point that youre never going to be playing the game without them.
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Other than the on use (mostly meme beam) my monk and ele/resto shaman would be basically the same with Azerite/essences/corruption removed.
A lot of random procs doesn’t make them help class feel and design.
Still waiting on a better alternative.
I was almost cutting edge in BfD, pre-nerfs until work became an issue, have been 2.2k+ every PvP season, and have done several +18 (+19s and 20’s in s2 when I cared more). So what exactly is competent to you? Please tell me on your main 
That explains why bear tanks with a thread of 1k+ posters have seen their feedback taken into consideration on alpha 
They did a good bit in legion, so again, you are wrong.
You legit have to be trolling
Make the classes able to stand alone without temporary power, and make temporary power less important
That would be a start
That’s kind of the point…
When you are forced to have something like essences, corruption, azerite gear, artifact weapons, etc to even be able to play your spec, it’s just bad design. They are balancing your class around those temporary powers.
Classes played well before azerite and artifact weapons and covenants.
If I understand correctly, you are saying without those classes would feel weak and bland, which is the point I’m trying to make…
Temporary power should only enhance the play style of the class, not control it
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You’re still missing my point, either that or we’re trying to argue two sides of the same coin. My point is, yes, without these borrowed powers the classes feel terrible. But you’re never going to be playing without them in the first place. Its kinda like saying that car sucks without its wheels, I’ll just stick to my horse, it worked fine before. Temporary power that lasts an entire expansion is no different than a new talent or new spell that you get for that expansion. If Blizzard came out and said, ok we hear you, no more temporary power, look at all the new spells were giving you. I could use your argument to say that the classes would feel weak and bland without those new spells, what terrible game design.
I’m just going to wait till PTR Make my decision on the trash level of specs then. I however currently like every single spec.
You played with very small amounts of borrowed power from BC - WoD.
There is no reason classes should be balanced around a weapon, or azerite gear.
those things should be balanced around the class, which is what caused BfA Azerite gear to fail so early on.
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You guys remember the old talents trees when there was actual flavor to them? Ye do that.
Actually I though button bloat was a real issue in MoP. I even had “/” bound back then, I don’t want to go back to that. Other than that I don’t see any real issues with what you’re saying, I don’t particularly enjoy large portions of my damage coming off of passive procs that can also proc death at the wrong time. It’s a gamblers way to play.
SL has to be better, is it too late to say it might be too early to tell? I’m not white knighting, it could suck, but I really really hope not. As bad as this expansion has been in many ways it’s still kept me playing steadily since 8.2 or so. I’m hoping I’ve lowered my expectations enough that I won’t be let down too hard.
Speaking of hard, I have an assault and an emissary that need done, but it’s almost all sidegrades at this point. Urge to play, fading . . .
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One of the bigger problems with temporary power is the abruptness with which it is gone compared to the length of time it takes to acquire it. If they could make the gear that delivers it fade out more gradually, I think people wouldn’t get as upset. This is harder for them to balance, and as we all know they can’t be bothered to hire some data people to simulate this stuff and talk to the playtesters to see what’s what.
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They do look awful. Adding a bunch of old spells at random was a bad idea from the start, but the masses cried for it and there you go.
They have no synergy with the kit and they don’t fix any of the class’ issues; at best they make the rotation unnecessarily complicated and/or punishing (Shadow Word: Death), at worst they’re not even worth a keybind (2s cast time Corruption).
Searing Totem won’t be the only spell to get unpruned-pruned.
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Yeah, TBH I really hope they lose corruption, because I just don’t want to deal with it with the frenetic way demonology is right now. That would be a really bad addition.
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That is a fair point. I do think there needs to be a balance between having enough abilities, but not having too many. I just hate the 3-4 button rotations on most classes right now (The GCD makes it even worse)
I think small stuff, for example, like warriors getting stances back baseline for instance (Defensive stance if you need to take less damage, battle stance for pure DPS) would make a big difference
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Yeah I’m not going to play SL because they stopped being bad at class design. For me it’s all about Torghast. The people in charge of making the anima deckbuilding game seem more on top of things than the class designers.
Totally agree. I can handle about 20 binds before I start to lose control. My DH doesn’t even fill all those though. And most classes I find myself using less than half the available spells with any regularity.
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I agree.
There’s some positives like the Blood and prot pally reworks. But most of the core issues with specs remain, which is staggering.
Not only that, some changes they’ve made are exxagerating core issues with specs. And, no, none of it is fixable with borrowed power systems, as i’m sure some fanboy will jump in about we haven’t seen legendaries, etc.
They need to fix deep rooted issues in rotations, resource interactions.
Just to name a few:
Frost DK is still broken AF with overcapping runic power massively being the optimal way to play with some specs. So what’d they do? Add a 2h but you can only use one rune, so this isn’t viable and introduces more complexity this company just can’t deal with.
Unholy still has 10 seconds of buttons to press before starting dps. Blizz solution? Add another CD on the GCD as baseline (gargoyle) and make outbreak take more runes.
Vengeance very core is still messed up with clashes between how the two resources they spend interact. They’re also having their meta uptime cut in half, and no changes to demon spikes. #tankkitingin2021
Attempting to fix the change they made to ignite spreading for fire (which wasn’t an issue). Built another change on top of it after feedback, which is now broken in several ways and has broken the entire spec basically. To top it all off, all this wasted design and developer time is going into something that nobody with a brain even thought was an issue with fire.
I could go on all day, it’s becomming a joke at this point.
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There is no difference between classes being balanced around a piece of gear that you always have equipped or a spell in your spell book.