Sylvanas secured Lordaeron which was really needed since the Horde has 4 leveling zones less then the alliance some inbalance that needed to be changed.
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They also had her defy the Warchief which was when writers were starting to plan her ruin. They follow this up in MoP with her wanting to kill and raise her own people against their will.
They were working on it for a long time.
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Sylvanas ruination was based on Afrasiabi doing revenge on Metzen cuz he killed Garrosh. Metzen actually created the Bfa trailer where she looked like a hero.
That’s what they say. But her change in character started before Garrosh was killed off.
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The Horde still followed her orders though. It basically wasn’t until Baine dug up Zul’jin to figure out who told him to put her on the throne that her authority started to get questioned.
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Right because she had earned her role as Warchief through deception. But that doesn’t mean the whole Horde brought on SL. Since Sylvanas did all of that in secret.
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Vol’jin and Bwonsamdi did that. Zul’jin ended up in Revendreth sadly.
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Yeah I don’t remember Baine being a part of that. I don’t remember Baine doing much of anything besides being a simp for the Alliance.
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The Trolls carried the expansion for us. All Baine did was moping in Thunderbluff.
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The Horde still followed her orders though. Like I’m not blaming you personally as a Horde player. I genuinely don’t care.
The entire conversation is that like 50 posts ago someone said that post-Legion Horde didn’t matter, which I refuted because the Horde actions that kicked off BFA set off the chain of events that caused Shadowlands.
Yes ultimately they were being used by Sylvanas, but it was STILL THE HORDE THAT DID THE THINGS THAT DROVE THE PLOT FORWARD.
Like that’s all this entire conversation is about. I don’t care if you liked or disliked it.
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She had no orders when it came to her dealings with the Jailer and Helya.
People say this because that started the whole doing quests for Alliance characters thing.
For the Night Elf stuff sure, but the rest no. You can’t blame the whole faction for what only Sylvanas knew about. Maybe Nathanos. But I’m not even sure she let him in on everything.
The whole discussion is about whether writers intentionally ruined the Horde and you are approaching the conversation from an in story standpoint. I also never mentioned my hate of it. I don’t think many people liked it, so that’s moot.
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The fact the Alliance had to help Sylvanas should shut down this complaint completely.
Horde burned down Teldrassil which started the war proper. Nathanos (who again, is Horde) used Xel’atath to signal Azshara to open up Nazjatar which lead to N’zoth’s release.
The Horde either directly on indirectly instigated almost every major event of the previous two expansions.
It’s not about laying blame, I don’t care about that. It’s about addressing the ridiculous claim that the Horde are unimportant to the story.
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I rather have our side doing then nothing instead of being the punching back for the alliance who gets to kill our leaders, raid our cities and hold speeches about muh honor in our godamm own capital.
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Really? Because y’all didn’t start into a descent of being narratively missing.
They still did zero of the work to bring in the whole breaking the cycle thing. None of that happens without Sylvanas doing that on her own.
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Blizzard is so deaf on the Horde story it is a surprise the community hasn’t fully quit all their subs yet. The constant abuse should have consequences for this company.
https://www.wowhead.com/de/news/aethas-sunreavers-trading-post-purchase-has-us-asking-questions-possible-330693
This story is beyond saving.
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Maybe your side should stop having genocidal maniacs in unaccountable leadership positions if you didn’t want to take some L’s.
No, I’m pretty sure they did burn down the tree. It was definitely a thing that happened.
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Stop frkn blame the Horde this was the doing of the writers alone.
Not talking about the tree.
And no matter who is really at fault, writers were the ones that sent the Horde down a path to nothingness.
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You can’t complain about taking L’s and also about the writers fixing the problems that cause those L’s to begin with.
If the Horde don’t want to keep getting whipped like a red headed stepchild, they need to stop being the villains, because in WoW the villains always lose.
On a story writing level, that means abolishing the position that lets unaccountable genocidal maniacs do whatever they want and post-war it means characters mending bridges.
Going “nuh uh, the parts I don’t like don’t count as real horde” is silly. The writers wrote the good parts and the bad parts of every faction.
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What does that even mean? Even legally you can’t fault people for what they didn’t know nor participate in because we had zero dealings with the Jailer nor Helya.
Yes, writers wrote everything. Characters don’t write themselves. What they wrote ruined the Horde and forced them out of the story completely.
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