Is Anduin the source of everything wrong with this story

Lore Story Forum
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So I’ve come to realize that since Anduin had become High King in Legion and perhaps even before this that he has been ruining the narrative for the game.

His motivations and actions don’t seem to be those of a regular person and because of that the player base has started to hate him.

I hope to break down and discuss the Flaws and issues with him as a Character.

Mary Sueism Anduin is certainly one of these. we have seen the character grow up since Vanilla and prior to Golden’s books and short stories he was always indicated to be pretty weak physically. Yet blizzard have been building him up more and more. Even the crushing him with a bell tjat was supposed to leave him a cripple he miraculously recovers from and even gets magic bones.

He wasn’t supposed to be skilled in melee and only average with a bow but now he can apparently throw down and destroy tanks. He also now such mastery in the Light he can raise entire armies from the dead and help make lightforged undead.

Motivations We have seen the Alliance go through trials in WOW and other Warcraft games. They have been at war with different Iterations of the Horde and have had multiple atrocities committed against them.

Since Anduin showed up in the comics has been a character looking for peace in contrast to his father who wanted the Horde destroyed, this balanced the two out. However now that balance is now gone and Anduin seems to act as if the Horde has never done anything wrong or chooses to ignore it. His Grandfather was killed by the Horde, His father was killed due to the Hordes retreat, His Aunty was almost killed and has been forever scarred by it by the Horde and The man he was named after was killed by the Horde and even he was crushed by the horde. Everyone that has been close to him has been hurt by the Horde yet he ignores this and still feels there is good in them.

His mother was also killed due to the machinations of a black dragon yet Anduins best friend is one who has also manipulated him as well.

How are the Horde supposed to feel about him when he is basically spending more time talking them up than their own faction.

Future forboding This occurred since the short story where Velen saw a light infused Anduin leading the Alliance and Horde in a Short story against the Void. Then got the comic showing him a future him leading us against the Void.

Anduin for no reason was put in charge of the Alliance as a whole just because his father was the previous high king. it feels as if the narrative is forcing him into the position to be our savior, not only the Alliances but the Hordes too this leads us to the next issue.

Mouth piece of the writers This expansion was supposed to be about pride in your faction as we went to war with one another. Yet Anduin has been used as the narrative good guy that wants peace between both. Even before the actual war has even started he is being written lecturing his elders about peace to those who want war and turning them around Such as Genn, Jaina and Turaylon.

He never declares that the Alliance is at war with the Horde only with Sylvanas and absolves all others of their Sin. The writer has come out and decreed she likes that he is not an aggressive male stereotype instead keeps him pushing for peace in a game called WARcraft, with the current narrative about WAR.

Conclusion Anduin is a neutral character that should have been pushed to the side during the faction conflict or killed and used to spark the conflict. He never should have been placed as leader of one of the factions during this war Narrative as it has taken away all agency for both sides. Also the writers need to stop lecturing the player base about peace in a game about war and just focus on writing a compelling narrative.

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The problem is the writters just cant write a complelling story i dont think it matters who leads the alliance or horde any faction war stiry will be sh*t

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It can be good it just can’t be handled by the clowns who are in charge.

Though its unsurprising given the quality of this current expansion.

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I don’t think this is entirely accurate. They need to stop lecturing us about peace with an enemy that turns around and attacks us at every opportunity. An enemy that abuses peace. For example, as a Night Elf, I should never forgive the Horde’s complicity in the War of Thorns. Peace is a pipe dream and Anduin needs to wake up.

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Anduin is certainly a Mary Sue, as are most characters of prominence in the Warcraft universe. Nothing new there.

The Alliance hasn’t had ‘just the rocky road treatment’. His Grandfather got assassinated by an assassin magically compelled to eliminate him. His father would have died whether the Horde held the line and perished, or if they retreated, because fighting an infinite army at the throne of their power was never going to be certain victory. His Aunt got off for free from a battle she instigated without so much of a lasting, crippling injury, if not killed outright from fighting the best the Horde had to offer.

The Horde probably should care for him as about as much as the Alliance cares for the Horde leadership - they don’t, with the one exception, who is met with seething hatred.

This expansion was the promise of many things but none of them were fulfilled, starting with the promise of faction pride. BFA is an unmitigated disaster and only a retcon would fix the lasting damage that it has done on this story.

His deceleration is pants-on-head stupid, as is most of the characters’ viewpoint on the conflict. It should come to no surprise that Blizzard is incapable of making a compelling war story that focuses on both the mundane and the epic. Both factions get to play with their hands behind their back, neither side gains any fulfilling victory and the victories that ‘are’ achieved make no sense as to how they accomplished this.

I think Anduin does have a place in the Alliance storyline as a diplomat, not as a leader. A Grand Marshal that leads the efforts should lead the military campaign, while Anduin is present only to negotiate when there is the opportunity for words.

He should certainly not be the main character of the Alliance.

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My point wasn’t that the Horde are bad, its that all bad things have happen to those family abd friends around him and the Horde have been responsible for those. Yet he seems to act oblivious that he is only position he is now is only because all he family died due the Hordes actions.

Yet its Anduin that is letting Saurfang go who horde players are supposed to respect. Its him that is defending and treating the Forsaken as actual good people, where Sylvanas just sees them as her “Bulwark against the Infinite.”

The Horde is supposed to like Anduin more than most Alliance leaders. Where as the Alliance is never supposed to blame the Horde leadership at all and put all blame on Sylvanas.

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No. Anduin isn’t the source of everything wrong, the lack of care from the writers is. Valerian Mengsk is a character from Starcraft who is essentially just space Anduin. A blonde prince who inherits the main human faction from his father. He’s idealistic and genuinely wants peace and prosperity for his people and the other races/factions of the Koprulu sector.

The difference is, is that the world Valerian is in doesn’t contort around itself to prove Valerian right or make things work out for him. Valerian is treated as naive and even has to deal with people scheming against him, but outside forces and at one point from within his government. This leads to Valerian tempering his optimism with pragmatism.

The point of this is, is that Anduin’s character type can be done well. Anduin’s ideals just haven’t been challenged at all since he’s become King. And no, Sylvanas doesn’t count, she’s been too much of a bald faced villain.

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As I pointed out Anduin has been challenged plenty but the story straight ignores certain aspects or bends so he is fine.

Father dies due to horde retreat - never comes up
Genn his foster father lost his kingdom to horde- never comes up
Jaina was almost killed by Horde- never comes up
Velen’s people were almost wiped out by Horde - Never comes up
His peoples city was destroyed by the original horde - never comes up

One forsaken priest shows up in the story and all of a sudden the forsaken are good.

One Tauren is nice to him and they become good friends, now all tauren are good.

One orc seems sad about assisting in genocide - Guess all orcs must be good.

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One I dont think he absolves the Horde from sin but at the same time simply going on a blind vengeance killing spree is against everything he stands for. Second, he has not been the only one, both Velen and even Alexstrasza have stated they were willing to actually give the Horde a chance to redeem themselves/believe people can change.

You mean the tank that was being attacked by the entire Alliance army/raid that formed? He may have struck the final blow, but he was not the only one attacking that thing.

That is nothing but head canon, at best Anduin realize that if the war is the end, Sylvanas has to be stopped. More importantly, he has mentioned, multiple times, he is fighting the Horde as it currently is under Sylvanas.

Have you even bother to listen to Warcraft’s central message since I don’t know, Warcraft 3? That these wars, as most wars, are foolish. But you should fight them still if it means defending those weaker then you. The Alliance is suppose to have the moral high ground. And to a certain degree that has always meant sacrifice and the need for redemption.

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Not saying that he needs to go on a mass killing spree, however actually wanting to protect the Alliance would be a start, bringing the horde to justice and not just shifting blame to one person would be good start.

Even if Velen and Alexstrasza did excuse them for the horrible things the Horde did to them in the past. How do you think those two should act now the Horde just butchered the Night elves who those two were close with? Should they be telling Anduin to give the Horde a 4th or 5th chance to change?

Didn’t say he one shot it, But he did manage to jump aboard it and plunge a sword through it then jump clear. Pretty good for someone not skilled with a sword and should be crippled by a bell landing on him.

That is the thing though, There is no logical reason for him to believe removing sylvanas would stop the war though, not like the rest of the Horde have promised to surrender if she died, its wishful thinking by him. This is the 2nd war in however many years started by the warchief and certainly not the only war they have had with the Horde. History should teach him that the Horde needs to be stopped and dismantled.

was the msg that we never punish those who commit genocide? Or is it that you should let people walk all over you for the sake of peace? Maybe its do nothing to protect those who are being bullied?

peace at any cost is acceptable? that is a pretty terrible message.

Just repeating that message over and over is stupid when its only one side in the right with the Moral high ground. The other is always in the wrong and consistently beaten down for it.

Especially when they use a mouth piece like Anduin to spout it at everybody.

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Just wait till he becomes corrupted (like so many other major WoW chars before) and you can kill him in the raid and be done with it :slight_smile:

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Who says we will simply let the main instigator, Sylvanas, survive. As for the rest of the Horde, we are killing them now and its not like they are gonna get out of this war whole. The question has always been how far the Alliance should push for justice without turning into revenge.

That has been the opposite of what has been going on. You are suppose to fight for peace. But the goal has always been peace itself. How you get to that peace is the big question BfA is gonna answer and we will find thaf out in about 4 or so months from now.

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More than that, Valerian is actually morally grey. The guy is complicit in his own father’s assassination, and runs around with a retired ghost bulter who “handles” people problems. I love reading about Valerian, I can’t say thr same about Anduin.

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This is exactly the issue with Anduin. Ironically, he is a character that has a lot of positive potential to offer a compelling narrative. A naive, unprepared idealist being put through a horrendous trial by fire can lay the foundation for greatly intriguing stories involving political machinations, internal friction, and moral complexity.

Unfortunately, the setting itself is simply written in a manner that does not oppose him or dissent when it should.

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Agreed.
I legitimately believe Blizzard is incapable of moving beyond the most superficial notions.

The concept of Andiun is awesome on paper.
We are supposed to love this kid. He has grown up with us since vanilla right?

But the execution is just so terrible.

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Much as I dislike him, I wouldn’t say he’s the source of all the story’s ills. Merely one of its most prominent symptoms.

The writers, of course, being the actual source.

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No argument about letting Nova handle people problems, but does complicity in the assassination of a genocidal tyrant (who just happens to be your father) really make you morally grey?

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Anduin is an odd case because his involvement has been somewhat realistic considering his character but for all the wrong reasons.

It makes sense that there are consequences for the Alliance deciding to put a 17 year old kid in charge as High King. It’s appropriate for Sylvanas to constantly run circles around Anduin and make him look like a total fool considering she is a several thousand year old military commander with centuries if not millennia of experience in strategy and combat and he is a 17 year old church boy who thinks that if you do the right thing you will win in the end. She was right when she told him he had no idea what he was up against.

The issue with Anduin is that this is accidental. They aren’t showing him failing to highlight his incompetence, they’re doing it to make Sylvanas look evil and scary. After the amount of times Anduin has put his lack of military experience on display, why has no one called him out on it? He is quite possibly the worst potential candidate for high king when his team has people like Muradin, Genn, Tyrande, Turalyon, Alleria… all of these individuals are far more qualified than Anduin for the position.

Anduin fails which is good, but there no consequences for Anduin. His failures are paid for by someone else and this is bad.

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Yes? Politics aside, its still patricide. I’d recommend reading the Starcraft books, a lot of Valerian’s story is in them. Valerian doesn’t lose any sleep being apart of some really dark stuff if it gets the desired “good” outcome.

It honestly feels like the marketing team wanted him to be high king, and the story team is just ignoring 800 pound gorilla in the room that doing entails.

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While I agree Anduin is the fly in the ointment of a faction conflict expansion, he’s hardly the only one, and I’d go so far as to say that there are enough other ‘flies’ that it gives the lie to what BFA is even about.

The Battle for Azeroth was never between the factions. That plotline was always a red herring intended to generate hype for the expansion and to generate a (not very effective) smoke screen for this being another Old God centric expansion.

Anduin wants peace. Saurfang wants peace. After a few patches, Jaina wants peace. Thrall wants peace. Just about every major lore character prattles on endlessly about how the conflict between the factions serves no ones interests but N’zoths. Even Sylvanas herself seems to imply that the war is just a distraction, a means to an end of achieving a larger goal that we know nothing about, but it seems we can rest assured it has nothing to do with victory for the Horde.

No the problem isn’t just Anduin. It’s how much the devs like to lie and falsely advertise to their fan base in order to fan ‘passion’ for what amounts to extremely disappointing and inept story telling.

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