It still felt like MM in Legion. The wack-a-mole portion of the rotation didn’t change at all except that the set bonus for instant AS was gone. It was whack-a-mole prior to the Legion pre-patch. It was wack-a-mole after the Legion pre-patch.
Again, you’re saying this like I’m not doing this exact thing. I am claiming that Combat was deleted - even if the name had stayed the same. I am someone. Who are you to say what I would or wouldn’t have done something if x, y, or z? I can tell you, without an ounce of uncertainty, that my position would not change based upon the name of the spec.
It did not. It wasn’t even close. BFA MM is far, far closer to when MM always was then Legion MM.
And I’m explaining why it wasn’t deleted, it was changed and the only reason anyone makes the argument for it is because the name was changed and the spec was almost universally not liked.
Almost every spec going into Legion was changed in significant ways, are you really going to make the argument that basically every spec was deleted?
For me, from the outside looking in, it felt similar. I can’t say how it felt for somebody who always played that spec. Prior to the pre-patch, I rarely ever played MM. I didn’t like it before the patch, and I didn’t like it after the patch.
No. I am not. There were a lot of changes, but the only specs that felt like entirely new play-styles (for me at least) were Combat Rogues and SV Hunters. They felt like new specs, not simply the same spec with iterative changes. Outlaw rogues felt so different, that I started calling them “The Cowboy spec” because I felt like I was in a saloon shooting up customers with my pistol. It hardly felt like a Rogue at all.
I’m really not sure why you’re so insistent about this. I really don’t have any skin in the game since I hadn’t mained a rogue since Wrath. I was just trying to point out that Rogues got the short end of the stick too, and I don’t want people to think they didn’t.
As someone who mained MM from Vanilla, yeah Legion MM played nothing like any iteration of MM before it. It was so bad I literally switched classes. It was so bad, that Blizzard actually went back in the direction of all prior versions of MM rather than doubling down on what they did in Legion.
And yet, these are the only two specs anyone tries to claim that were deleted.
Kind of just goes to prove my point. Significant changes to specs that were generally liked didn’t have people claiming their spec was deleted.
Significant changes that were generally disliked but kept the name the same, as in the case of MM, didn’t have people claim their spec was deleted.
Only in the case of combat/outlaw because of the name change do people claim their spec was deleted. If the name had remained the same basically no one would have ever tried to make that claim.
RSV actually kind of has a leg to stand on in this argument because, while the name wasn’t changed, it’s raid role of being ranged dps was changed to being melee dps. They removed one of the only 3 ranged specs in the game to put in a melee spec.
The Warrior is a hybrid class. Sure, not on the same level as a druid ofc. But still, it is a hybrid. Whether everyone…agrees…with how much, doesn’t really matter here.
Besides, the Warrior class has a tank spec as well as options to focus on dealing damage to the enemy because that is the two most iconic fantasies/archetypes connected to Warriors. Not just in this game in particular.
Compare Hunters here…
A Hunter, especially in this game/world, the lore and all archetypes of Hunter characters are about one thing, the balance of life and death and preserving the essence of the hunt(and everything that comes with it).
Neither in terms of specific archetypes, nor when it comes to the general lore of this game does it fit for a Hunter to be the grand protector of all. They also do not heed to any spiritual calls like Druids do when we talk about the essences of healing.
In lore, Hunters are closest to that of Druids. But like I said earlier, Hunters follow different paths than Druids.
In short, it does not make sense for a Hunter to be a “tank” nor a “healer”. Hunters in this world focus on taming beasts to aid them in combat(specifically for things like the protection of the hunter himself as well as others).
Hunters do have some healing capabilities, but that extends to themselves along with their fellow companions(pets).
I very much agree here.
And if you ask me, a more apropriate name here would be something like “Munitions” or perhaps something more akin to “Trapper”.
The thing about the old name “Survival” is that it stems from the semi-original theme from Vanilla where it was not an actual Core Specialization that came with a defined identity in terms of playstyle. But it was a talent category which contained talents focusing on all parts of the class that were designed around your “Survivability”.
Once they moved away from the “The Class is everything”-concept in favor of the introduced Core Specs, it no longer made any sense in keeping SV-talents like they were, basically prior to WotLK.
As for what I wrote earlier regarding “Munitions”, I based that on the original theme tied to the names of our original talent categories and what each of them focused on.
Beast Mastery - was just that, a set of talents that all focused on the bestial aspects of the class.
Marksmanship - was all about the use of the ranged weapon. Nothing else.
Survival - like I said earlier, was about everything else. About increasing our survivability depending on what type of content we engaged in.
Munitions - would be a suiting replacement for a name instead of Survival because of what it actually focused on, in terms of it’s general theme and it’s abilities and aesthetics.
It did focus on the enhancement of our arrows/bullets and our traps(mostly).
That depends entirely on a persons subjective view on the matter, coupled with the historical design behind it/them.
If you ask me, neither RSV(Pre-Legion SV) nor MSV(current SV) really fits the name itself("Survival).
Nowadays when we have such defined fantasies/themes/identities for our specs, their names should reflect what they focus on and how they do it.
Survival, does not even hint at what the current spec is actually designed to do(how it does it).
Couldn’t agree more.
Not everyone wants all the flashiest or the grandest of animations. Some actually likes it a bit more subtle.
That doesn’t meant that it[they] has to be distinguished by entirely different types of weapons.
Yep.
What I said earlier, “Munitions”.
Well, you tell me. Check the suggestions I posted a little more than a year ago for what RSV could’ve looked like in the modern game. (Link below)
Sure, it would have a lot more than what it had in the past. But it would for certain play a lot like it did before.
The problem stems from them trying to go back to class identity with still having the specializations. If they want back to go back to class identity we should have the old talent trees back. Just my two copper…
I guess it depends on what we mean when we say “Class Identity”.
You can have a core identity of a class while still having multiple different specs to pick between. For pure focused classes like Hunters, Mages, Warlocks, Rogues, it’s okay for them to have only specs focusing on one single role. They don’t have to focus on different sub-roles(like ranged vs. melee). Or on different combat-roles.
Legion was a garbage expac that ruined the vast majority of specs and brought about some of the dumbest systems that hamster wheeling treadmill addicts love.
RSV got destroyed too mate. Pretty sure I’ve never denied that.
Despite that, Legion SV was one of the only somewhat interesting specs the expac contained. Almost everything else was a dumpster fire in how they played.
SV sucked, but it wasn’t because it was poorly designed like everything else in Legion.
Most of what I’ve done is make fun of people like you for being unable to move on 5 years later because it’s hilarious.
Pretty big difference.