Important WW PvP Beta Feedback

Been playing, streaming, experimenting different ww builds and playtesting them as good as possible in solo shuffle and wargames, the gameplay really is thoughtful and you have to pay attention to a lot of things which for now is a positive in that regard.
There are unfortunately some glaring issues with WW at the moment and it might and will probably go into deaf ears but let me touch on it for a bit.

  1. Rising Sun Kick is massively undertuned, it is supposed to be this button in the windwalker rotation where you are “oh wow this guy just flopped” but as we speak at the moment it just tickles people.
    my average Rising Sun Kicks go to like 300k with my highest being 550k on 7-8m HP pools some of those numbers were able to be achieved in Dragonflight during Serenity windows, so please take a look at that.
  2. Same Story for Fists of Fury, my average Fists of Fury ticks are like 200k ± with around 17% Haste which again for 7-8m HP pools is insanely undertuned for the core ability of windwalker.
  3. MASSIVE Issues with Shado-Pan Hero Talents. While this counts to PvE too, there are existing talents which are based off proccing flurry strikes shortly after your first set of flurry strikes. Realistically it is not possible to spend 400 energy in a span of 6 seconds to receive value out of the agility bonus from “Against all odds” which is stackable to 20. Similar issue exists for the Wisdom of the Wall Procc which makes your Flurry Strike do shadow damage AoE, currently it is impossible to ever get any value out of this wisdom of wall procc.
  4. It would be a very welcomed change if Rising Dragon Sweep would not share the same knock DR like Ring of Peace. It soft forces every windwalker to play Song of Chi-Ji which per se is not a bad ability but it would still be a nice QoL when your Ring of Peace actually functions.
  5. The disarm range nerf feels really terrible, I feel like the 30yards were completely fine for a long period of time, why change it?
  6. If Skyreach isn’t returning please think about maybe tuning the PvP modifier from Flying Serpent Kick to 20s CD again. 30s feels too harsh and is certainly the worst state Flying Serpent Kick ever has been in since MoP. Mobility in general is a very careful resource for windwalkers now and you’re way too punished when just one little thing goes wrong. While this could be a player specific issue this is almost unavoidable vs certain classes (e.g Mage pressing Ice Nova on your Roll stuff like that). Some things to help Windwalkers mobility in PvP would be a very welcomed change in the future of season 1 or even season 2.
  7. Please a small damage protection for Paralysis would be nice, it just breaks to thin air in TWW especially and with chiwaves bouncing around and everyone having AoE abilites built in their main rotation it is super hard for Paralysis to stick in PvP.

There is still time and some of those things are just tuning problems. I’d like to mention again that my first 2 points about RSK and FoF are greatly impacting WW gameplay and it makes you feel nothing has value and priority in your rotation due to RSK&FoF still living in Dragonflight

13 Likes

There’s no way this math is gonna math come launch, like statistically it’s impossible.

My 486 ilevel monks on dragonflight are critting for 250-280k or so in prepatch.

No shot after gaining tons of agility (I am even undergeared for live) it doesn’t go up substantially from that.

I’m not saying it’s not bugged or something on beta, but doesn’t sound right.

2 Likes

gz on doing more testing of WW monk than all of blizzard in the last 4 years

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To add on to all of the above mentioned Feedback we’re still struggeling.
The Post above doesnt really convey how tough the loss of Skyreach Dash has been for most WWs.
I think i speak for a lot of us when i say that especially in the current Meta we’re almost unable to stick to a target, or have to waste excessive mobility just to catch back up.
I understand the Talent being a problem in PvE, but please just make the Dash a Honor Talent, our Honor Talents as it stands right now are basically predetermined as we basically have 5 Talents that are simply not working or arent worth picking.
On top of that it the Post above doesnt mention our DMG distribution, in most of the Games i played Karma and a Weapon enchant are my Top 2 and 3 DMG. With Blackout Kick being #1 due to the Cleave on Pets / AoE.
Playing WW currently feels like you’re at the mercy of your team finding opportunitys to kill while you yourself contribute little to nothing.
With the short CD on Fists of Fury a much needed addition to FoF would be the ability to kick while it channels aswell.
Please make FoF and RSK worth pressing again

6 Likes

I 100% wholeheartedly agree with both Cutiepie and Edenx Statements, criticism, and suggestions. We need something done.

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After today’s changes to WW monk, i just wanna get back to the Topic at hand.
We’re thankful for the changes to Shado Pan so that we atleast have a viable option to pick in the hero Talents from now on.
Sadly neither of the important Parts got adressed.
Worse of all its more of the opposite actually.
After our initial complaint that WW in TWW was lacking mobility, that we tried to bandaid fix with Clash, the CD of clash got increased to 60 seconds up from 45 (the initial 30 when Alpha started gave us hope that it was supposed to be our “connect to a target” Button) and to top it all of, the CC duration of Incap got reduced from 4 Seconds to 3.
I am just not sure anymore what currently is seen in Windwalker monks that im apparently unable to understand.
How can one of the weaker The war within specs be seen in Streams, Reddit, from the Feedback in the forums and someone overlooks Mages, Ele’s Fury warrior, Warlocks, Subrogues and point at WW and be like “yup i swear that guy had a utility spell, that should be nerfed”
Even if we’d get Skyreach back as a PvP Talent and we’re talking just the Dash, our current Top DMG AFTER the Patch is a passive unload of Flurry strikes followed by Karma and a Weapon enchant.
Can we please get some feedback or some tuning on RSK and Fists of Fury.
Atleast let us know what you see in the Spec that atleast for me and a lot of other High Rated monks just isnt there…

4 Likes

major +1 to this whole thread, WW feels bad in pvp right now. even if we were tuned properly, i don’t know how it could be fun, its really hard to get up time on casters without skyreach.

even if skyreach (jjust the dash) wasn’t brought back, something would have to change with our current mobility. giving flying serpent kick the ability to not get rooted on it, or the ability to control direction would be neat

just to touch on this, can we get an answer as to why this interaction even exists? shaman’s literally have unleash shield as an honor talent, which knocksback the target that doesnt DR with thunderstorm.

mages blast wave doesnt have knockback DR

evokers tail sweep knock up & tail knockback don’t dr.

it really doesn’t make sense and makes the talent feel worse to use, because its actually a sick little peel for a second or two (think peeling for your healer into ret/warr)

This x1000, you can eat a chaos bolt into a poly as long as its within like .3 sec of the poly landing, but if someone looks at your paralyzed target it breaks??? make it make sense? if paralyze got that little immunity window that almost all other cc has it would feel super good to use.

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if it wasnt so comical it almost would be sad. Since i typed this post exactly Nothing has changed and the only changes were 2 horrendous terrible nerfs to Paralysis duration and Clash CD increase. Devs are just out of touch, better to find a new class or just quit it all together for once and for all, this ww version although REWORKED is worse than the DF version which is very HARD to beat because DF WW was also really bad designed.

the absolute only redeeming saving grace is that in the backplans they have fists of fury stun returning but if that does NOT happen then just throw it in the trashcan

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like im glad touch of karma is actually doing damage,

i just wish it wasnt my top damage in a 3 min game lmao. we’re in shambles and the expac drops in 19 days. hopefully we see some significant tuning and more rework

the worst part about it is that WW is apparently both good and fun in pve, so its unlikely to change much more i feel like

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Im lowkey afraid that we will end up with some last second overtuned numbers that will mask the underlying issue for a Season and then we have the exact same discussion as we do right now again.
It feels so hopeless to even attempt to give feedback on this matter because it feels like its just turning on deaf ears.

EDIT: After today’s PvP Changes we say thank you, we appreciate the first adressing of part of our problems and we’ll be back here with more Feedback!

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bro para nerf butttt the storm earth and fire change literally could be enough to make it feel good

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While i agree that SEF is a very good change, it still doesnt really adress our Main points of concern.
While SEF (especially into the Caster heavy meta that we assume is about to happen) was very easily CC’d it still already provided some value. Though the CC Immunity is HUGE, we somewhat expected it to happen at some point.
The Problem now is that while our Ghosts have Uptime on a target we ourselves can’t really stick which is going to feel really weird.
On top of that even with 9% more RSK DMG i dont think we’re at a point yet where our consistent Pressure is high enough.

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Holy crap. After all these years, Blizz actually went and made clones cc immune. Still kinda hurts that it went from 45% clone damage to 40% clone damage though.

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If we’re going to be forced into playing SEF, the CC immunity on clones makes it slightly more bearable.

Also, I feel like having so much of the damage in PvP be moved out of FoF and RSK doesn’t feel fun. I mean, damage is still happening through procs and passives, but that’s not particularly exciting. I think monk is at its best when you have a couple high-impact buttons that you’re pressing frequently, but it just doesn’t feel that way anymore.

5 Likes