They definitely won’t give us dots and I don’t think death knights are more mobile than Paladins at all. Especially with how suspectable they are to roots and snares
The difference is they have grip and they have dots so they don’t need to stick on you the entire time
Well if they allowed us to do part of our damage up front and the rest in dot form that would be interesting.
Big issue is we are still immobile Dk’s are supposed to be the slow moving class not paladins. Not saying we should have the movement of monks or DH’s.
I will saying with DK’s tool kit it can be more mobile than ret paladins a dk would need to know when to pop DA as its more of a proactive ability.
And the fact that BoF and Steed is on the global it feels very clunky trying to use both. I will say if steed was on a shorter cd and we had 2 charges baseline we would feel a bit better in the moment department.
I don’t know that I agree with your title, I don’t feel like immobility has a direct tie to our class fantasy. There have been lots of examples in the Warcraft universe where Paladins were not a wheelchair class.
To tie into what I quoted I would not mind a play style like this. What we lack is something that keeps our target in a small zone. Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on your viewpoint) Ret is getting consecration back. They could add a little flavor to this by making it the counter to the monk’s area knock back. Make it so that if you take the first hit of damage from Consecration then you are locked into the area of it. Give it a 10-12 second duration with a 30 (no more than 40) second cooldown. This would make it so that if we get our target in our wheel house, then they could be in trouble but not impossible to survive. The key would be so that only those that get hit by the 1st dmg strike are stuck, this would allow smart play by others to try to avoid it initially and then come back into it. It would also give Paladins the opportunity to make really good plays with timing their burst and CC. It would allow Ret Pallies to continue to be that support/utility dps class that Blizz seems to want them to be.
Or what if our Damaging abilities left a “burn” on the target, a smexy dot, replicating DMG delt to the target but over say 6 seconds. BAM, OP, maybe, but I would dig it.
And I’m talking all abilities, not just say “TV”. This burn would stack, so say you hit with CS for 5K, the target would burn for 5K dmg over 6 seconds as well, but in that same time frame if you hit for another CS for 10K, it would add another 10K to the dot, and extend the duration back to 6 seconds. It would almost be like Ignite, so I guess there’s that (a rip off of fire mage mastery). But It may help our sustained, might be a little too strong though during Wings CD.
Paladins also have had dots in the past so yes that can be part of our class fantasy. In years past we had Seal of Corruption/Vengeance used to leave a dot. When seals were removed so were the dots that our abilities would leave.
I wasnt asking to be turning ret into Affliction with pure dot damage, so obviously with upfront damage and with some dots options.
To be honest, I’d like Hand of Hindrance changed into a 1 holy power cost and cooldown removed. You send a holy chain to your target snaring its movement speed by 50% and applying a dot to the target and 4 nearest enemies.
Blade of Wrath could come back as a talent, but changed so it’s not OP like it was in Legion. Your blade of justice now deals holy damage and leave a small dot on your target.
TV/DS leaves a dot equal to 25% of their damage for 10sec. Being affected by this dot again adds its damage to the current dot without refreshing the duration.
Wings could be changed into a 1min cooldown, 10% damage and increase the damage of the the left by TV and DS to 40%.
Generating 5 holy power could trigger a buff that increase haste by 10%, and movement speed by 30% for 8 seconds.
I am okay with paladin being less mobile in general. The problem is that our DPS is crap outside Wings and inside Wing we are the primary CC target. Now if you combine this with our lack of mobility it makes for frustrating experience against good players.
They could keep the mobility the same but maybe dial back the effectiveness of CC when Wings are up.
Imagine thinking our class fantasy is to be slow when Paladins used to be the most mobile melee in the game.
Exactly we had good mobility in the past. But they seem to want to keep us on par or worse than dk’s.
Consecration.
What are you literally talking about in classic you have no movement abilities white warrior have charge, rogue and feral has sprint hunters have cheetah, shamans have ghost wolf.
Even to wotlk warriors get more charge, rogues get shadowstep, feral gets pounce.
Meanwhile Paladins don’t get divine steed until **LEGION **
From Cata up to the end of WoD we were quite mobile, with Emancipate and either Pursuit of Justice, Long Arm of the Law (which we even both had in Cata) or Speed of Light. We also had reliable tools to slow enemies with Seal of Justice and Burden of Guilt.
Not sure how it was is BC and WotLK, but Vanilla is not a good example because there was less mobility in general and classes weren’t fleshed out.
Caked in movement speed has always been on feral and they’ve had a charge.
Even in those versions I wouldn’t call us the most mobile class when warriors and rogue are leaping /teleporting everywhere
nah bruh double freedom, emancipate, speed of light, long arm of the law, and there were some more it was so fun to play and now it feels so bad RP walking. i miss having fun with this class
We don’t need to be the most mobile, but we have to deal our damage somewhat consistently. That means either decent mobility to stick to a target, reliable slow capabilities or the capability to deal damage mid-/long-range (spender damage that is). None of this exists in the game currently.
Can you please tell me how we weren’t mobile please?
We had mobility since day one. In Vanilla we had baseline 15% movement speed.
In Wotlk we had a judgement that negated anyone from running above 100% movement speed.
In Cata we gained Long Arm of the law, 45% movement speed for 4sec after Judgement and it had 6sec cooldown. We also gained emancipate which removed one movement impairing effect on use and had priority of removing root over slow.
In MoP you had the choice between Pursuit of Justice (15% movement speed + 5% for each holy power up to 3), Long Arm of the Law and Speed of Light. (70% movement speed for 8sec on 1min cd). Also Seal of Justice was changed into a 50% slow for 6sec for every attack and we had Glyph of the Burden making judgement apply a 50% slow for 2sec.
In WoD we still had all of that plus Empowered Seals with seal of justice giving us a 30% movement speed for 15sec. This coupled with Pursuit of Justice and Long Arm of the Law was making you run at 75% movement speed if you had 3 holy power. Or 75% movement speed for 4sec when using Judgement. Also Clemency, allowing you to have 2 charges of Freedom.
And in Legion they removed all of those mobility effects to replace it with Divine Steed. Only Divine Steed. So yeah it’s in Legion that they deleted our whole Mobility to have this stupid and utterly bad horse.
That doesn’t make sense when you consider the fact that every class in the game has abilities to get out of stick, unless they give ret reduced stun cooldown. So yea if ret can somehow make it so every other class doesn’t have mobility anymore then sure. But giving ever class mobility is the reality of the game for everyone except for ret. More stick IS more mobility.
Both classes are slow juggernauts, and it doesn’t feel particularly great for either.
This post convinced me you started playing Ret in Legion. I won’t repeat the mobility we had before then since others have already, but you don’t know what you’re talking about.
For the love of the light just bring back laotl already, why is this even a debate, steed is THE WORST movement ability, not just in this mmo but in literally any video game I have ever played hands down. But then again doesn’t matter much to me lol, prolly ditching ret in SL as half our added skills look pointless when compared to what we need lol.