Yeah, they’re invading Quel’thalas any way you put it. Military force in our land without permission = invasion. That’s fact. I get you’re trying to downplay that with silly things like intent, but it’s a breaking of rules, and an invasion.
They know we’re there. They didn’t go “oh, this is occupied, sorry”.
The scourge is not their main objective by a longshot, Blood Elves are.
Invasion:
an instance of invading a country or region with an armed force.
Well, is it your land if you cannot hold onto it? That was the party-line from Forsaken players for ages when arguments cropped up about Lordaeron and whether it belonged to survivors who fled or not. The fact the Alliance could not/did not take Lordaeron was evidence that it wasn’t their land.
Considering the Ghostlands was not secured, one could argue that the nelves were invading Scourge territory, not belf territory. Lest we forget, even Liadrin makes an appeal to this idea that whoever holds land at the time is it’s rightful ruler, considering in the Warfronts between her and Danath she states that the Trollbane claim to Arathi had expired long ago.
Same thing that any of the three nelf camps or that island are. An invasion into Scourge territory. Liadrin would agree, since she see’s Danath Trollbane reclaiming Stromgarde as an invasion into Horde territory.
Liadrin is one of the leaders of Quel’Thalas. I’d say her view on the matter of land ownership is highly indicative of the views of Quel’Thalas itself. If she believed the rightful sovereign of a land is whoever holds it, as evidenced by the Arathi Warfront, then it is only logical to conclude that the belves had no claim over the Ghostlands during their questing, since they did not hold it secure.
Ergo, the nelves never, “invaded,” belf territory. They invaded scourge territory. Maybe Amani territory too, one of those camps wasn’t too far from Zul’Aman after all.
This is such a trash argument. Liadrin doesn’t lead the Blood Elves, and even if she did, she isn’t the geneva convention. Night Elf military literally invaded Blood Elf territory, knowing the implications and there’s no getting around it.
Whether you accept that or not, up to you, but facts don’t care.
Sorry, but at the time, the belves did not hold the Ghostlands secure. It was Scourge territory. Liadrin’s words in the Arathi Warfront make it clear, it doesn’t matter how, ‘ancestral,’ your claim is. If you don’t hold the land, it’s not yours. A statement from an official of Quel’Thalas.
So about the Satyr in Teldrassil, the twilight cult in Darkshore, the defias in Eversong, the troggs and ice trolls in dun morogh, the dragonmaw in the mountain pass, this makes this not official alliance territory as soon as that happens, right?
By the Horde’s standards, I would say yes. The Alliance, however, seems to acknowledge historical claims on lands. I mean, that’s part of the conversation between Danath and Liadrin in the Arathi Warfront, after all.
I’m pointing out what we have in the lore. Liadrin, a member of the Horde and commander of Quel’Thalas, makes it clear what their view on land ownership is.
I think the hypocrites here are the belves. “The Trollbanes have no right to their lands because they lost them, but we have total right to ours despite also losing them.”
Nope. Just means the Alliance and Horde disagree on land ownership rights, and the belves, being on the Horde, are hypocrites for believing this applies to THEIR lands, but not to anyone else’s.
You know, I’d even go so far as to say this idea that the belves had the right to claim the Ghostlands as theirs despite not being able to hold it and protect it, is just further evidence that they really are an Alliance race at heart.
Not at all. Who owns land is a fundamental disagreement between the Alliance and Horde and always has been. The Horde believes whoever is strong enough to hold land is it’s rightful owner, while the Alliance respects historical claims to land.