I Was Warned

During Legion, and the first 3 volumes of Chronicle, I got completely obsessed with Lore. Bought every book, read or listened to several novels.

But the old guard, at that time, was furious. Legion era lore was full of retcons. Those former enthusiasts walked away.

Now it’s my turn. My dissatisfaction began almost immediately in BFA. Today is my breaking point.

While my “generation” of lore enthusiasts abandon Blizzard… a new generation is discovering lore for the first time. And enjoying it.

Best of luck to you all. But like my predecessors, I’m warning you now about the emotional distress of future retcons.

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It’s wild to think about how Nu-Blizzard sees us as folks to toss as long as they can get someone new to replace us.

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Well, good luck for you on whatever new adventure awaits you :+1:

I understand you I was at the same stage during BFA when I thought the Horde is gone for good. I never judge anyone who thinks Hope is lost.

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Well yeah, you were warned by Moi that Jaina did nothing wrong and Chronicles IV will confirm yet again. :slight_smile:

I sympathize. What happened today that was the last straw? Have I missed something?

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Probably learned of the retcons in the new Chronicles book is my guess. It’s been a major talking point lately as everyone gets their books and point any information they think important enough to talk about

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“Retcons” have existed in all media (and in real life) since the dawn of civilization. Get used to it. A retcon is often an improvement, so this idea of hating a retcon for the sake of it being a retcon and nothing else is straitjacket insanity.

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This is true, and for an IP that has existed as long as WoW, retcons are inevitable. That doesn’t mean retcons should be done without care though. For many of us, a coherent story and universe are necessary for maintaining our immersion in said universe. Even under the best circumstances retcons chip away at that immersion, and when retcons are too frequent or poorly executed, it just straight up destroys our suspension of disbelief.

I, like the OP, am past caring about WoW’s lore or story at this point. But a part of me still misses when I used to care. A few people on this thread are probably going to tell me that is a ‘me’ problem, and maybe they have a point. But still, that is one less reason for me to be enthusiastic about this game, and consequently, one less reason for me to support it financially.

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I don’t know your opinions personally, but I just don’t generally buy this kind of speech, as I’ve seen these exact lines parroted over and over and over again on these forums. This exact argument is given for reason X and reason Y, and it usually comes down to habitual professional haters who have been upset about the Eredar retcons or the Nathrezim retcons for the last 20 years and refuse to move on with their life.

I’m just tired of listening to retcon haters, because it usually comes down to them fuming over a 20-30 year old retcon like babies and pretending their arguments are more complicated than they actually are.

You are entitled to your opinion friend, and I can kind of see where you are coming from. It is the internet. People use hyperbole. There is also a certain percentage of people out there who somehow derive their entertainment from hating a thing, rather than the thing itself. We have all dealt with that at some point and it can be obnoxious.

But I am being completely genuine when I say that the passion I had for the storytelling in this universe just isn’t there anymore, and the frequent retconning of fundamental lore is a big reason why.

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Welcome to the club buddy, I have hopes for TWW, but I am Cautiously Optimistic. SL and DF bit me in the rump roughly. At this point I haven’t been playing for lore for a long time, and that kills me. I love a good story, I hope TWW delivers in some capacity.
Usually my intuition is correct, the One Piece Live Action sucked to me, yet I went in with hope despite a gut feeling to it sucking beforehand. Wasted 7 hours of my life on gutter trash. TWW Will grasp for the stars and drown toward the end I suspect. Or it’ll be the “One-Shot Kid” and be 1-2 patches only. We’ll see.

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I can believe this, sure!

But in general, most of the time here: the last decade of internet “debate” should have taught people that opinions can’t be taken at face value, and “I hate retcons” is one of those things that’s usually is a lie that secretly translate to “I’m still bitter about my pet issue X, and I’m bending my entire life philosophy over backwards to justify this one belief and I’ll fight to the death to defend the lie that I hate general retcons because I don’t want to admit the embarrassing truth that I’m obsessed with X.”

Like, I’ve seen real people on this forum:

  • Insist that the entire canon of books and extra-game lore must be discarded as unreliable… because they secretly just hate that Tides of War retconned Orgrim as honorable instead of assassinating Lothar.
  • Insist that Blizzard is secretly an anti-Xtian cabal out to get them… because they’re still bitter over Of Blood and Honor retconning the Light as a force for good literally over 20 years ago.
  • Claim that Blizzard lore is garbage and can never be trusted… because they actually just can’t get over the Eredar retcons that happened before most people here were even born.

And other crazy things. I’m just tired of the rampant intellectual dishonesty where nobody admits their true motivations, and retcon hating is one of the biggest harborers of dishonest takes on this entire forum.

This isn’t quite the case with World of Warcraft for a simple reason: it’s a video game first, a story second.

So, when we get a retcon such as, “The guy who designed the Silverpine Quests somehow completely forgot the Kirin Tor were neutral, so uh… that whole bit with the Forsaken wiping out the Kirin Tor at Ambermill never happened,” the problem arises that the game world never changes because they don’t bother to either update or remove the quests (old content, no incentive to fix it’s narrative), and thus we have an existing retcon that remains like a festering wound.

Later, we get retcons that change the fundamental nature of the setting as we were meant to understand it.

When the Chronicles came out, it was a lore book, word of god, hard canon. Later, when new writers came in and wanted to tell their stories, they retconned the Chronicles to being, “Written from the perspective of the Titans, whom aren’t omnipotent, so if we do anything in the future that doesn’t make sense, its because the Titans don’t know everything.”

That resulted in the Shadowlands, lauded as the worst expansion, period.

When WoW introduces retcons, it’s rarely to the benefit of the setting. Their only purpose for WoW is to allow the, ‘Rule of Cool,’ stories to be told. This riddles the setting with so many holes that it becomes increasingly difficult to understand and, as a result, more arduous to immerse oneself.

A retcon such as Sargeras corrupting the Eredar instead of the other way around did add something to the setting. It made the Eredar far less intimidating an enemy, but we ended up with the Draenei as a result. I’d say this was an example of a retcon that was effective. Most WoW retcons, however, have been to the detriment of the setting.

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I keep saying, just treat this story as fanfiction or as a seasonal story where the previous season is not very relevant

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It also made Sargeras more clever and Kil’jaeden 3-dimensional. Because of what we learned about Archimonde in Legion, it became clear that Sargeras was putting on an act solely for Kil’jaeden. Archimonde would’ve joined regardless, Velen was always going to be suspicious and ultimately decline, but Kil’jaeden, being on the fence, just needed that little push. And Sargeras posing as his pre-corrupted self, framing the Legion as a righteous cause was that push.

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There were plenty of terrible books before. This book changes the timeline. Was that really the final straw?

I get it. Sometimes you just hit one thing too many, even if that particular thing is pretty minor.

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Some people have a different breaking point then others. I can understand this. I assume this will grow since TWW might be very short and boring.

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I don’t think this ever should have been a thing. It played too many hands, way too early, instead of letting this information be found out naturally.

Imo, this was one of the best changes they ever made, as it now makes Chronicles 1-3 the perfect springboard for theory making. Sifting through the lies and half-truths, and cross-referencing them with what we see in-game and in the novels to find out the facts is fun.

90% of my issues with Shadowlands are all gameplay-related. Since diving into the story and what it’s actually saying, it has become narratively one of my favorite expansions so far.