I’ve always loved the character Sylvanas who was so heroic as a High Elf only to be treated so horribly by an evil baddy. I envisioned her story would eventually bring her back to her roots and that her life of heroism wouldn’t go unrewarded. I’m still hoping.
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The issue with this is … she still has yet to be given a strong enough motivation to over-ride her perpetual fear of her own afterlife (which she was given in “Edge of Night”). As far as I can tell, that motive never really went away (in fact her actions in Legion reinforces that).
Its great for people to claim that “Oh, she can change, she can eventually regain some of who she was in life”; but without a proper motivation (that is MORE POWERFUL than her fear of being locked in eternal torment) … Sylvie has no reason to change course from the path she’s been on for over eight years.
She’s a selfish nihilist who uses others for personal objectives; then discards them if/when they are no longer of use to her. She’s a MASSIVE control freak, due to her time being powerless under Arthas. She’s paranoid as all hell, due to her own nature (and the several major betrayals she’s suffered in life).
Ironically however, one of those betrayals was NOT the Alliance turning down her call for aid. She was not a member of the Alliance of Lordaeron when she died, and thus they could not betray HER when she became undead. It sort of builds into that strange reality that she’s never really been a particularly good representative for the Forsaken race (on several levels, not just that one).
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I keep rereading this and every time I still like it.
You’re insinuating that, pre-Arthas, Sylvanas was not afraid of death, so she lived. Now, she’s afraid of “death”, so she’s being more cautious and her entire existence -ironically now in undeath - is not to die.
I don’t know much about forsaken lore but I would imagine that when forsaken die, they’re subjected to the same eternal torment that Sylvanas is? I wonder if her “redemption” is just merely becoming an avatar of death, that allows all those forsaken who truly “die” to Rest In Peace and not find endless torment.
Someone far smarter and more creative than I on here mentioned they think Sylvanas is trying to carve-out her own “realm” in the Shadowlands. ill try to find the individual to give them the proper credit.
Interesting to ponder…
Edit to add:
Here’s who initially made this hypothesis, or at least the first time I’ve seen it
Mak’gora is a contest of honor. She doesn’t qualify. We know from ghost Vol’jin that she is Warchief on false pretenses. We know from her cavalier disregard for her Warchief’s orders not to use the Blight in Cata that she regards obedience to a Warchief to be optional. Rules are for other people.
No. She is a monster, and a tyrant, and needs to go. Now. Before she makes things worse.
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Can’t wait to see how being a loyalist to Sylvanas blows up in the player’s face.
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Teldrassil is a smoking, ruined husk; no one holds it, unless you call staring at it from a distance an occupation. Coincidentally, that’s exactly what the Alliance is doing at Undercity; staring at a city they can’t occupy…so it’s ridiculous to make a comparison of one situation being better than the other.
I pointed out that I’m Tauren only after you made several erroneous assumptions that I was in the enemy faction. Even now you continue to allude to the possibility, and intentionally ignore the reasonable explanation that I’ve only been leveling her for the past month because she isn’t the first character I’ve played this expansion.
Ironically, my oldest character…which I created in the first week of Burning Crusade…is the same race and class as yours; a Forsaken Warlock. I haven’t leveled him in BfA, simply because he’s just not that interesting anymore…and I post on this character because it has the longest history on the forums.
The reasonable question you might ask would be, do I have any Alliance characters…and the answer would be yes. It would be silly to limit myself to playing only half the game. However, my first love is the Horde, which I consider to be much more diverse, more fun to play, and with the best races in the game. If you don’t believe it, that’s your problem.
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I keep reading people saying this not just you but
How can she be a selfish nihilist if she has
A nihilist believes there is nothing to life, that nothing has meaning, but here she is fearing her own death and trying to do everything to stay alive (undead).
Rather have it blow up in my face then betray the Horde. And following leaders who are not shy of commiting treason.
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She’s too popular with the overly male fanbase of this game it would be a huge mistake if she just gets killed. She actually has a lot of female fans too at one blizzcon a woman spoke that said sylvanas story reminded of her when she had a car accident and nearly died.
Ok Elf. That still makes no sense. It would STILL be worth it to issue the Mak’Gora to prove that she would be either unwilling to participate, or unwilling to honor the results. THAT would undermine her legitimacy. By not issuing the Mak’Gora, they do nothing to challenge her legitimacy, and allow her to commit further atrocities. Going to the Alliance instead is cowardly and there’s not excuse for it. There is already a procedure for challenging a Warchief and it does not mean consorting with one’s enemies.
I don’t know why you elves bother to comment on Horde politics at all, considering you wouldn’t have rolled Horde at all if they didn’t give us a “I wanna be pretty!!!” race. I’ve said this elsewhere but I hope Silvermoon burns too.
She was always like this since her undeath, it’s just be spot lighted now.
From the very being the forsaken alliance with the horde was from convience, (From the classic undead opening) and was working on the blight from the very get go. She never cared about anyone but herself, it’s why she committed suicide after Arthas died, Forsaken be damned.
Do you not remember when she forced Varimatheras to kill his kind so he could prove his loyalty? Remember when she had a perfect chance to kill Arthas? But didnt because she wanted to toture him first?
Her change was in cataclysm because she now had a new reason to live. That reason being to escape any chance to die and go back to what she belived was hell.
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H Hey? I am OP please. We’re not all like that actually a lot of us have the reputation to be the quite opposite from his opinion. Hence where the meme Blood Elf poster comes from.
She fears it because she knows she’ll end up in the same place as Arthas so she’s doing everything she can to guarantee she deserves being there more than even he apparently.
I felt it appropriate to post this on my Horde alt.
I personally feel that Sylvanas has shown that she’s only out for her personal power and selfish gain.
Now, I will say that a few things I noticed that show different lights from the Alliance perspective to the Horde perspective do explain the motivations of a few of her decisions. But her justifications for breaking her own vows (undead to be free of mind control) in the name of a war campaign, doesn’t sit well with me.
Personally I side with Baine on this. I do view Saurfang as a deserter, and he should be punished as such, but Baine stopped her from taking an action that she could not have come back from.
I really liked her character during WotLK but ever since she’s gotten more and more… Depraved. More and more focused on her own personal power and influence. She make a point to disobey Garrosh before he turned evil. On a regular basis. It seems like she’s actually making an effort to alienate the rest of the horde. Or get them killed so she can selfishly turn them all into undead, and mind control those she wants.
She reminds me of the people I know who act as though you owe them everything for even the slightest favor they have ever done you. Those kinds of people are toxic. If you want to call it bad writing, you can, but I see a lot of parallels to the real life phenomenon of corrupting power. Some just can’t handle having that kind of influence, and Sylvanas is written as a character who has let the power go to her head.
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Disregarding the fact that I think you are wrong on that statement. That still doesn’t make her a nihilist though.
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okay, me relaying the details of the story to you and you refusing to accept them isn’t a fact. You’re right, she’s not a nihilist, she’s a cowardly scumbag.
Thats your opinion, I respect that, I disagree with it but that just makes us different and not both wrong as we both view it from a different perspective. Either way glad you agree shes not a nihilist.
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it’s not an opinion that she knows she will end up in damnation alongside Arthas when she dies, it’s not an opinion that it terrifies her.
Its your opinion that you think she is a
As I find that her afterlife is a legitimate reason to fear it.
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A logical conclusion based on her actions
You’re alright. Don’t go to Silvermoon tomorrow.