I kinda don't like spell batching


(Afflextion) #104

you could probably make a batch rate add-on tbh… you only have to query the server at logon to know when a batch is, then it’s the same interval after that


(Ziryus) #105

/shrug if it makes you feel better to pretend that RNG is skill more power to you. It’s more knowledge, just like knowing how to increase your crit rate is knowledge. However actually getting a crit is not skill.


(Eaglesgift) #106

Can’t say, but seems it would be stilted game play.

A good frost mage uses an instant cast right after a timed cast into a frozen target - fishing for a combo. A brain dead mage sees a frozen target and throws one frost bolt after another - no chance ever to get a combo.


(Ziryus) #107

Now if blizzard would actually provide a spell batch window ticker that the scripting API could use that would be interesting and move it a lot more into the realm of skill.


(Afflextion) #108

it was more luck than skill in vanilla with low net speed now that latency is lower than the batching window it’s easier to manipulate and play with, watching streamer duels they are cc’ing each other alot, pally can hoj a charge, etc…


(Eaglesgift) #109

Do you think good poker players lack skill. It is not all luck you know. Apparent good luck can be made with skillful decisions.


(Ziryus) #110

It can to a certain degree.


(Eaglesgift) #111

If I get more crits than you because I understand the mechanic and I fish for combos and you do not, you don’t understand that my play is more skillful than yours?


(May) #112

actually I’m certain that the cast gets through and the kick does. The spell school gets kicked but the cast is through.
That’s what happened.


(Ziryus) #113

Crit is literally broken down to a % chance to crit no matter how hard you hit the attack button it doesn’t change what that percent is, if you are talking about using abilities that increase crit sure. But then that’s different than something like where your spells fall in batches as you control when you use abilities.


(Ziryus) #114

Yep, just like how two people can CC each other. It’s pretty stupid.


(Palaceknight) #115

actually I’m certain that the cast gets through and the kick does. The spell school gets kicked but the cast is through.
That’s what happened.

Yep, just like how two people can CC each other. It’s pretty stupid

This is not the normal behaviour for interrupts and not how it was in vanilla. Very rarely would you ever experience this behaviour and it was not because of spell batching.

Interrupts where explicitly coded to over ride the spell going through as long as it was executed properly within the cast time. The backend was explicitly coded to over ride this spell batching behaviour.

Interrupts where very crisp in Vanilla and this has even been confirmed by Kevin a man who actually developed classic and knows what he is talking about vs your abritary notion that all spells that have executed to 85-90% being almost guaranteed to execute due to spell bathing. This is simply false.

This behaviour was super rare in vanilla and not due to spell batching. It was infact a bug if anything vs intended behaviour.


(Ziryus) #116

I’m very certain they haven’t gotten spell batching right in classic. Given they are using the retail batching system but modified to try to emulate the 400MS window. It’s just very hard to prove especially as we have no visibility to the actual batching.

But I agree that things seem to be stacking up in the same batch more often than they should.


(May) #117

Kicking in the 90% range was risky even back in wrath when the same happened. In the spell batching thread itself blizzard confirmed behavior that says that the spell-school should’t even get kicked:

Idk what your problem is. You don’t like it?
Cool.

And if it is really bugged and blizzard was wrong, they will certainly have checked it by now, you’re not the first to claim that its off or whatever.


(Palaceknight) #118

I really do not have a problem but you just directly responded to me something that was subjective and false and I simply pointed that out.

I explicitly stated that I am all for spell batching, however the current iteration on the beta is not accurate nor true to how it was in Vanilla and needs to be refined.

I actually wouldn’t be surprised if they are actively looking into this issue, considering we are still in the beta phase and that is the ultimate purpose. Just because they haven’t actively said anything about it recently does not mean it is not actively being tested and refined on their end.

I am also going to trust an actual dev that played a big part in the actual code base of the original game i.e., vanilla up to WoTLK. Over a CM subjectively talking about the game 15 years later.

I already stated that this behavior was seen, however the notion of it being “relatively common” is subjective and false. These cross cc events were not as guaranteed and common as they currently are on the beta.

Interrupts also followed a separate paradigm to begin with from a CODE perspective. The notion you claimed about interrupting a spell at 85-90% almost guaranteed to go off due to spell batching is just factually wrong.

I never once stated I want spell batching removed, or that I dislike it. I in fact am all for it, however this wonky iteration simply needs to be refined to be a true representation. The current iteration might as well be a completely new implementation that the game has never seen before.

Edit:
Also lets call a spade a spade, your initial passive aggressive response towards me was simply a thinly veiled biased response because as a caster main you felt threatened by the notion of interrupts being actually tuned and balanced to their original design as that would directly impact your personal game-play perspective in a negative manner.


(Galdor) #119

And how do you know this? Blizzard would probably have said something by now if it wasn’t functioning properly.

Is this another “feeling” based on 15 year old memory? What ms do you think the batches are set to in the Classic beta?


(May) #120

Getting personal so quickly?

I simply know, as I played the game A LOT from classic to wrath (and pvp only), that kicks often DON’T get through when you kick late. Making the 0,5 second wl pet recast more of a read than a reaction, cause of the behavior stated above.

Doesn’t mean that you’re wrong, but it was common for late kicks to not get through. Maybe it is too much on the beta, Idk. But you make it seem like 90% cast time kicks almost always went through, while they certainly didn’t.

This is about authenticity not personal preference.


(Ziryus) #121

I think the batches are set to 400MS just like they were in vanilla. I think though that classic because it’s actually using the modern engine isn’t processing the batches the same way.


#122

I don’t know that still doesn’t really read to me like the balance changes were done specifically with the batching in mind - but more along the lines of they just both existed in the same world; but I could be wrong.


(Palaceknight) #123

No it is based on the recollection of an actual classic wow dev who was involved with class design up till WoTLK. Feel free to catch his stream and ask him yourself.

Also yes part of it is also based on my recollection and what I am experiencing currently on the beta.

Exactly and your toneality and sentiment has shifted and ultimately is agreement with what I have been saying since the beginning.

Once again it is nothing personal. I simply stated the reality of the nature of your first post and you have since shifted away from that mentality. We basically are saying the same thing at this point.

Also for clarification I simply stated that interrupts have always been pretty crisp and while the interaction between a late interrupt and a resulting cast still ensuing has always been a reality it is not as pronounced as you made it out to be in your initial post. I also would advocate that 85-90% casts were being more readily kicked then not.

It also seems to be behaving inconsistently on the beta with how it should be.