I do not understand how people roll need when wearing more powerful gear

[Jmagus-alleria]

I tanked it, ill need on it. If theres no more reason for me to run lfr, then you can wait just a little bit longer for a tank.

[Antiman-bloodhoof]

@Galabris-alexstrasza

This is a good thing.

Some might see it as such, till we start getting complaints about the game being dead as no one queues for the content or it is “too hard” because people are being stupid/lazy.

The issue is the system needs to incentivize gear players running LFR but at the same time, make sure that people after upgrades can get them without having to roll against those same geared players.

[Cowvenent-area-52]

@Alathea-elune

@Cowvenent-area-52

We can only go by what Blizzard has given us

then the argument should have been done once you see that blizzard lets players choose to roll need on an item that isn’t an ilvl upgrade, otherwise they would have already restricted it just like they do with tier tokens.

Thats what blizzard gave us.

Except that some lower ilevel items ARE actually upgrades (e.g. Rashok’s Heart). The most likely scenario (IMO) is that it’s too technically difficult to determine whether something is an actual combat upgrade or not. So Blizzard gave us the more permissive option to err on the side of leniency.

@Alathea-elune

The only reason transmog buttons exists, is because they wanted to separate it from Greed.

so that greed rollers would be the last option over someone who rolled greed for the mog ( example a paladin cannot roll on polearms as a “need” because they are almost always agility so they can only roll greed, but rolling greed

That’s feasible, but it’s still separate from Need. That a paladin cannot Need an agility polearm actually is more proof that Transmog is separate from Need as well. Otherwise, they should’ve been able to Need it.

Again, all of this means squat because there is nothing a player can do about it. But I think that’s actually a great example of Blizzard’s intent when it comes to the rolls.

[Adorability-moon-guard]

What does that have to do with entitled people wanting geared players to not be able to roll at all?

[Alathea-elune]

@Cowvenent-area-52

Except that some lower ilevel items ARE actually upgrades (e.g. Rashok’s Heart). The most likely scenario (IMO) is that it’s too technically difficult to determine whether something is an actual combat upgrade or not. So Blizzard gave us the more permissive option to err on the side of leniency.

if its too technically difficult then unless you are going to start simming every single person that gets loot you’ll need to just accept that they wanted the piece for whatever purpose they want.

Again in my absence, some other person would have rolled anyway, what did you lose? You are just upset that you don’t think some ppl deserve loot and it should auto go to dudes in blues.

@Cowvenent-area-52

That’s feasible, but it’s still separate from Need. That a paladin cannot Need an agility polearm actually is more proof that Transmog is separate from Need as well. Otherwise, they should’ve been able to Need it.

Again, all of this means squat because there is nothing a player can do about it. But I think that’s actually a great example of Blizzard’s intent when it comes to the rolls.

If blizzard intended the rolls to only be done based on performance improvement, they wouldn’t put mog appearances in the raid and it would just all be generic gear from outdoor dailies with raid stats, that way no one would ever be tempted to roll on anything based on its appearance.

[Kentaurus-turalyon (Kentaurus)]

@Alathea-elune

it would just all be generic gear from outdoor dailies with raid stats, that way no one would ever be tempted to roll on anything based on its appearance.

They did this with WoD’s LFR and it went about as well as you would expect. No one bothered. lol

[Alathea-elune]

@Kentaurus-turalyon

They did this with WoD’s LFR and it went about as well as you would expect. No one bothered. lol

amazing, I skipped wod because of real life stuff and I could have told you this would happen

[Kentaurus-turalyon (Kentaurus)]

Yeah, WoD was quite a rough patch for everyone involved.

[Cowvenent-area-52]

Again, speaking from Blizzard’s intent on what rolls mean, you gave the perfect example. If Need was meant for Transmog, pallies would be able to roll Need on Agi polearms.

However, as I’ve stated before, this doesn’t matter except that you can’t pretend it’s intended by Blizzard. So who cares? People are gonna rationally think you’re a jerk if you roll Need on a mog. Just live with it and move on.

As far as why put unique mogs in LFR? Let’s say they’re the same as Normal, Heroic, or Mythic.

Raider: “Why does my gear look like it came from LFR? Change this, Blizz!”

[Azuremi-proudmoore (Azuremi)]

I am assuming they want the mog, since LFR does have some nice color variations on some armor.

[Sarama-firetree]

@Antiman-bloodhoof

is it really fair for those looking for upgrades to have to go for the full season without?

They’re more likely to go longer waiting if they never have those geared toons in the raid that can’t actually roll on everything.

[Cowvenent-area-52]

Objection – witness is over-exaggerating the impact and number of higher geared players who need no upgrades from LFR

[Alathea-elune]

@Cowvenent-area-52

Again, speaking from Blizzard’s intent on what rolls mean, you gave the perfect example. If Need was meant for Transmog, pallies would be able to roll Need on Agi polearms.

Again if blizzards intent with rolls was only for performance improvement, they wouldn’t put desirable appearances in the raid, and would only put generic outdoor gear with stats.

@Cowvenent-area-52

However, as I’ve stated before, this doesn’t matter except that you can’t pretend it’s intended by Blizzard.

you are pretending blizzards intent, and I’m showing you why you are wrong and you just ignore it.

@Cowvenent-area-52

rationally

irrationally, to be clear. Ive already explained in a million ways why it never mattered who got it, and people keep telling me its not that they didn’t get it but that they didn’t like who it went to, even though their chances never improve even if I am not there.

Its emotionally charged reaction to seeing who got it that they cant get over, not a rational one since there is no proof their game is improved in any way when heroic raiders get kicked out. or PL comes back or whatever other thing you think is fair.

@Cowvenent-area-52

Raider: “Why does my gear look like it came from LFR? Change this, Blizz!”

ok, remove appearances from LFR and have them only be in heroic/mythic and maybe normal and watch LFR die , WOD did this

[Sinelius-area-52]

Simple: Transmog /thread

[Sarama-firetree]

@Cowvenent-area-52

witness is over-exaggerating the impact and number of higher geared players who need no upgrades from LFR

So, this is really a non-issue because the number of people “stealing” loot is so inconsequential? Great, problem solved and we can close all these threads.

[Cowvenent-area-52]

@Alathea-elune

Again if blizzards intent with rolls was only for performance improvement, they wouldn’t put desirable appearances in the raid, and would only put generic outdoor gear with stats.

That’s silly. What does that have to do with the types of rolls?

@Alathea-elune

you are pretending blizzards intent, and I’m showing you why you are wrong and you just ignore it.

No, you’re not proving anything. If Need was meant for Transmog as you said, a pally would be able to roll Need on an Agi Polearm. I don’t really know how else to explain that to you, but it shows that Transmog is not a Need. Nothing you’ve said has proven the opposite. There might be coincidental differences or bad decisions, but you have not logically shown anything to the contrary.

@Sarama-firetree

So, this is really a non-issue because the number of people “stealing” loot is so inconsequential? Great, problem solved and we can close all these threads.

And now you’re over-exaggerating what over-exaggerating means.

[Kentaurus-turalyon (Kentaurus)]

But they can’t roll need for an agility polearm because the loot restrictions…you know, restrict them to only being able to roll on certain drops when it comes to the Need roll. The only thing that the Transmog loot roll shows is that it is largely useless because no one’s going to roll Transmog on a maybe when Need gives them a better chance. And if that pally wants the polearm, they are out of luck unless every eligible player in the raid either has it or passes, or also rolls Transmog, which is rare, but possible.

[Xenna-bloodhoof (Xenna)]

@Endofline-dragonmaw

I do not understand how people…

Majority of people in this world are self centered greedy and selfish. It’s been this way since the beginning of recorded time and isn’t ever going to stop.

[Cowvenent-area-52]

Yea, I never said it was a good system lol. As I’ve mentioned, I was only trying to prove Blizzard’s intent.

[Kentaurus-turalyon (Kentaurus)]

Which you cannot.